Can someone from Ableton please answer this post.

Jarvisimon · Post by **Jarvisimon** » Sun Apr 05, 2009 10:22 pm

I have really enjoyed my time with the Live 8 beta, it's very impressive indeed, so much so, that I would like to upgrade my license to the full 8 suite.

However, I am perturbed by the number of people who are having problems with the software and would like to know the answer to these questions:

Will you be supplying us with daily/weekly bug fix updates until the software is considered stable? If not, what will your immediate actions be in order to make the software reliable?

I am asking you direct, as I feel this has to be answered properly before I part with my money.

I certainly don't want to be buying software that will crash my system knowing that it will be a long time before a solution is offered.

Even though I think it's excellent value for such a great set of tools, it's still a substantial amount of money to lay out for the majority of users.

I take it there are quite a number of people in this forum who would also like to know what Ableton's actions to rectify these problems will be, so if they want to bump this thread until an official answer is given, go ahead and do so. All it takes is the occasional +1 to keep it on the main page.

Jarvisimon · Post by **Jarvisimon** » Mon Apr 06, 2009 7:37 am

Well if no-one's gonna bump this post then i'll have to do it myself.

You could at least +1 it if you think it's a question worthy of a response from the Abes.

Too often, nobody actually asks a question direct to the manufacturers, which comes over as rather defeatist. If you've spent your hard earned money on something and it's not working, then you should be entitled to an answer as to when it's gonna be fixed.

Feel free to add your own questions, you never know, they may well just respond.

cids · Post by **cids** » Mon Apr 06, 2009 8:23 am

Dear Jarvisimon, I don't know what your config is but just to let you know that Live 8.01 is running stable as far as I've tested it the last days...

Jarvisimon · Post by **Jarvisimon** » Mon Apr 06, 2009 8:30 am

Glad to hear it, however, that certainly doesn't seem to be the case for everyone.

It's unnerving knowing that any further bugs will have to wait until an update is released, especially when there's no fixed time schedule for that release. So this thread is really about asking the Abes direct about what they are doing about the many bugs people are still coming up against.

I don't want to buy a buggy release without some prior knowledge of their intent to stabilise it 100%.

kleine · Post by **kleine** » Mon Apr 06, 2009 8:35 am

Hello Jarvisimon,

I honestly have seen worse versions than the Live 8 debut version - which i personally find quite well so far.
To answer your questions: Yes, of course we´ll do our best to make the software
as stable as possible (and beyond) - that´s our job and interest.
You might have realized that nowadays it´s slightly more difficult to produce
software which is stable for all possible usecases than it was 10-15 years ago due to
the enormous increase of complexity/OS issues/third party support... the list goes on.

Best,
Christian

$4mU3l · Post by **$4mU3l** » Mon Apr 06, 2009 8:46 am

Jarvisimon wrote:Will you be supplying us with daily/weekly bug fix updates until the software is considered stable? If not, what will your immediate actions be in order to make the software reliable?

This is obsolete and sounds like a challenge...

1. Live 8.0.1 runs very stable so far (12 hours producing and performing). That means Live 8.0.1 is in a usable state, anyhow there are some bugs...
2. These bugs where fixed immediate and reliable in the past and so it will happen in the future.

No need to worry

Edit: Ooops, the Abes anticipated me...

Jarvisimon · Post by **Jarvisimon** » Mon Apr 06, 2009 8:55 am

kleine wrote:I honestly have seen worse versions than the Live 8 debut version - which i personally find quite well so far.

Hi there Christian,

Yes, i'm not doubting there's much buggier software out there and I really do think Live 8 is something special, so don't think that i'm chiding you just for the sake of it. However, it would be good were there an official announcement that you will be making regular fixes of any bugs that are still surfacing, even better would be a guarantee that bugs would be fixed in say a week or so.

I apologise if this sounds harsh but I have discovered on other forums that a direct question is a much speedier way of getting your needs met than just asking other users. After all, they're not the ones who can fix things, it's the company alone who do this.

I hope to upgrade to the full suite by the end of the month. Would be great if there were no problems with it at all by then.

Jarvisimon · Post by **Jarvisimon** » Mon Apr 06, 2009 9:16 am

reflective7511 wrote:
Jarvisimon wrote:Will you be supplying us with daily/weekly bug fix updates until the software is considered stable? If not, what will your immediate actions be in order to make the software reliable?
This is obsolete and sounds like a challenge...

It's actually a request not a challenge.

There is no official timeline as to when further updates will be released now that beta testing is over.

It's one thing not coming up with any bugs however, this is obviously not the case for everyone and if the next update isn't due for 3 months then a lot of people will be disappointed. I don't want to be one of these disappointed people having shelled out £x for something I can't use properly.

CarlSeleborg · Post by **CarlSeleborg** » Mon Apr 06, 2009 9:17 am

Hi Jarvisimon,

I would say: let the tradition live on! If I may simplify a
little, our general policy is to never promise anything but
always do our best to deliver great software. We've always been
committed to fixing bugs and provide regular updates, we shipped
11 bugfix updates with Live 6 and 15 with Live 7.

So I don't think there's any more need to do an "official"
announcement to that effect now than there was before. Besides,
there are tons of improvements in Live 8, certainly enough to keep
the most demanding users busy until the next update

Cheers,

Carl

Jarvisimon · Post by **Jarvisimon** » Mon Apr 06, 2009 9:35 am

CarlSeleborg wrote:So I don't think there's any more need to do an "official"
announcement to that effect now than there was before.

Hi Carl,

I'm not knocking the improvements whatsoever, infact, i'm not knocking Ableton or their creation.

However, I don't agree with you on this point and would feel more comforted knowing that an official announcement had been made in regards to bug fixes needed for problems that are still coming to the surface.

Having read the myriad of posts concerning crashes/hangs/inability to even start up, not having an official response is like saying "we'll get round to it when we're ready".

If someone can't get the thing going properly do they really have to wait for the next update so they can play with these new features you're talking about? Without some pressure put on Ableton, this could be a wait of several months. So sorry, i'm not entirely happy with your answer.

I really want to get Live 8 suite but I need some proper re-assurance before I part with my money otherwise i'll leave it for 3 months and let everyone else have the problems for me.

Please, can we have some official words of reassurance? not just to say things are better than they were 15 yrs ago.

CarlSeleborg · Post by **CarlSeleborg** » Mon Apr 06, 2009 10:09 am

Jarvisimon,

Ableton has a rather modest-sized development team doing all the work
on the software itself. There really is nothing else for us to do
than "get around to it when we can", and that's exactly what we're
doing - all of us are fixing bugs right now. We've always tried to fix
as may of them as we could in the past, and there's no reason to
expect anything less from us this time.

Carl

leinad · Post by **leinad** » Mon Apr 06, 2009 10:15 am

cids wrote:Dear Jarvisimon, I don't know what your config is but just to let you know that Live 8.01 is running stable as far as I've tested it the last days...

Hmm. Ocasionally when I doubleclick a clip, live just crashes.

NI Acoutsik Piano and sometimes NI Kontakt 3 with an Acoustik Piano loaded in it breaks the ouputs of the plug-ins (DC offset at 1.0f whenever a sound is output).

There was another crash, I can't remember how I caused it.

Stable is another thing. (Not to mention the lack of keyboard input routing to vst plug-ins)

I just hope as well that they keep pushing out a new build once a week or so like they did in the beta stage.

I upgraded anyway because of the great new features.

Jarvisimon · Post by **Jarvisimon** » Mon Apr 06, 2009 10:40 am

CarlSeleborg wrote:Jarvisimon,

Ableton has a rather modest-sized development team doing all the work
on the software itself. There really is nothing else for us to do
than "get around to it when we can", and that's exactly what we're
doing - all of us are fixing bugs right now. We've always tried to fix
as may of them as we could in the past, and there's no reason to
expect anything less from us this time.

Carl

Hey there,

Yes I can understand the undertaking you have taken on in regards to bug fixes and i'm sure you are all working long hours to cure as many of these problems as you can.

So why not complile a weekly update of fixes to download so that the work you are doing can be immediately enjoyed by paid Live 8 users, much like the regular updates you released during the beta testing.

Something like this would give me sufficient reassurance that an upgrade would be worth it despite knowing that it is likely that I will run into further problems with the official release....or at least until all known bugs were cured.

Also, I would like to thank you very much for the listening you have done so far. It really does go a long long way and i'm sure this isn't just my view on your support.

I post in other music software forums and see a lot of peoples concerns being totally ignored. As I said before, the idea of my directly addressing Ableton was born out of seeing this and it's refreshing to have some proper interaction for a change. So this one little extra step would really round things off.

Oh and whilst we're at it.....do you have any plans to update Sampler's time stretching functions?

The ability to play a single sample across the entire keyboard with even time stretching would put yet another smile on my face. I'm sure there are a few other things that could be improved but this is the most obvious one.

kleine · Post by **kleine** » Mon Apr 06, 2009 11:55 am

Jarvisimon wrote: The ability to play a single sample across the entire keyboard with even time stretching would put yet another smile on my face. I'm sure there are a few other things that could be improved but this is the most obvious one.

Did you know: Session View slots can be assigned to a MIDI note range for chromatic playing: First
play the root key (this is the key that will play the clip at its default transposition), and then,
while holding down the root key, hold one key below the root and one above it to define
the limits of the range. (see the manual p. 460)

best,
Christian

Jarvisimon · Post by **Jarvisimon** » Mon Apr 06, 2009 12:16 pm

kleine wrote:Did you know: Session View slots can be assigned to a MIDI note range for chromatic playing: First
play the root key (this is the key that will play the clip at its default transposition), and then,
while holding down the root key, hold one key below the root and one above it to define
the limits of the range. (see the manual p. 460)

Hi Christian

No I didn't know that, I suppose it's a workaround but it sounds more like a procedure and not quite the same thing as having Sampler play it.

I've still not been answered my original question with regards to bug fix updates.

I've been told there's plenty of things to go through in the meantime but that's not going to help anyone if their system crashes whilst doing various functions.

Have you read the many posts from people who have paid for their upgrades and found them unuseable so are reverting to 7? Sort of defeats the object of upgrading altogether so I feel more than sorry for them especially if they're going to have to wait for ages before it's any good.

I would rather have a proper answer in regards to how often bug fixes are to be presented to us users. This is now an official release (and by the looks of it a premature one), so an official statement on this matter is the least you could do.

Can someone from Ableton please answer this post.

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