how to automate CC's within ableton

mylkoa · Post by **mylkoa** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 3:08 pm

Hiya

If I enable an IAC bus, should I be able to see it in
a tracks MIDI in routing pull down menu?

I tried for an hour or so yesterday to get this to work,
but no luck so far.

I can record CC, or I can move a filter cutoff (for example),
but I can't do both at the same time.

If I assign a cutoff to a knob on my trigger finger, it
won't record the CC data.

If I delete the knob assignment, I can record CC knob
movements, but the filter cutoff won't move.

ryansupak · Post by **ryansupak** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 4:38 pm

mylkoa: You should be able to see the IAC in Ab. if it's enabled. Ab. might need a restart but I don't think so.

Do you have access to any kind of MIDI monitoring software? If you're on PC MIDIOX can do this, and (since you're) on Mac MIDIMonitor can do it. If I were you I'd check the signal flow at every point, starting from the beginning.

I must say, though you've realized it by now -- this was always kind of a clunky workaround; a Saturday after-brunch "lab project" if you will. I would not recommend using it live.

I think the real solution here is for Ab. to include a "Controller Data In" MIDI input to the software, perhaps with some sort of feedback loop protection. The ability to send OMNI out would also be handy.

rs

matthewvenn · Post by **matthewvenn** » Mon Apr 24, 2006 4:33 pm

repost

mylkoa · Post by **mylkoa** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 12:19 pm

Thank you for the tip about setting up a track to output to IAC, that
was the missing key!

Going back over the post, I can see now the pictures that people
posted with tracks outputting to MIDI Yoke, and it makes sense. However,
when I initially read the thread, I ignored those pics because I figured
that since I was using IAC and mac, that those pics didn't apply to me.

But I can see now they certainly do.

So let me get this straight, you need to to arm two tracks to use this method, correct? That's how I got it to work at home.

One track with an Ableton VSTi

One "blank" track routing MIDI to IAC (or MIDI yoke, or whatever)

On the blank track, I had to route MIDI straight from the controller
I was using (in this case, a Trigger Finger) to the IAC, otherwise, if I left the
track as "All Ins" input, I would get some bad feedback, hanging
notes and things.

I think it's interesting and signifigant to note that Remote data IS NOT
recorded. Rather, CC data is recorded, which is sent to a surrogate MIDI
entity (IAC/MIDIyoke) and that surrogate is the one that is assigned as
a remote controller. As far as I can tell, Remote Data can only be drawn into the clip view, or recorded in the Arrange view... I think it says that somewhere in the manual, but who doesn't like to try to hack?

I COULD NOT get this to work if Ableton was set to accept my controller's input (Trigger Finger) data as Remote (as per the Preferences tab). Here were my MIDI preference settings:

Input Section

Device Track Sync Remote

IAC On Off On
Trigger Finger On Off Off

Output Section

Device Track Sync Remote

IAC On Off Off
Trigger Finger Off Off Off

In my tests, the settings on the Remote Controll Surface
menu (at the bottom of the MIDI pref page) didn't matter.
I ended up leaving "none" in every box, although, if you own
one of those remote surfaces (like the Mackie), I bet that
menu applies to you.

Another mentionable thing I have found is that remote data, recorded on an Arrange track clip, can not be dragged over to the Session view or into the
clip view's envelopes.

For example: In the arrange view, record some notes on a track while playing wth a knob that is remotely assigned to controll the filter cuttoff. The remote data will be recorded in the arrange track, you can see it in the pull down menus to the right where intsrument info is. But this filter tweaking will not show up in the clip
view down below. You can copy the remote data from the arrange track and paste it into the clip view, but I haven't gotten this to work. The clip seems to ignore the
data, and if you switch a screen and come back to it, the data will be gone.

For those who don't know, a clip can be dragged from the Arrange view to the Session by grabbing hold of the clip in the Arranger, switching to Session (press Tab) and dropping that clip into the session view (an appropriate track or blank area). I just learned that trick from reading the archives a few weeks ago... wonderfull. If it's in the manual, I missed it. Perhaps that's why it pays to re-read the manual as one gains familiarity with the program.

In conclusion (it's about time). I don't dig this method of recording into clips. I prefer to use a VSTi like Reaktor and use it to assign remote controllers withing itself, that way, knob tweaks are recorded as CC into a clip, and that clip drives the VSTi. It's much more efficient and musically friendly.

In any case, thank you guys for posting this thread, and your suggestions!
Improved comprehension of Ableton's behavior is certainly an asset here.

Be well,
Andrew

mylkoa · Post by **mylkoa** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 12:20 pm

oops, my neat MIDI pref settings got garbled.

I will post a screen shot later.

intellijel · Post by **intellijel** » Wed Sep 13, 2006 5:35 pm

I finally got midi automation working on my system. I am using a BCR2000 (in Mackie Emulation Mode). I found that I have to disable midi inputs in the Remote Device setup while I assign midi controllers, then re-enable it once they are assigned.
If I don't do this, the knobs will not have their automation recorded. This is kind of a nice way to pre-select some knobs to be recorded and others to be free of recorded automation.

but I have a problem:

I noticed some CC values do not work! Like CC120 and 121, others are fine.

Is there a reason for this?

thanks, intellijel

btw, I am using midi yoke (2 channels, 1 for husker vu, one for routing the remote signals) and Huskervu

audiolemon · Post by **audiolemon** » Mon Dec 18, 2006 3:27 am

This seems to have been settled a long time ago but I just found it now.
The picture links seem to be missing... so I find it hard to follow.

I wonder could someone give me a picture of the MIDI preferences. I have tried to set up MIDI Yoke but I either get nothing or MIDI yoke is disabled because of feedback and Ableton crashes.

I have WIN XP with Ableton 5 and I have MIDI Yoke installed. Maybe somebody might even have an .als

I really would like to be able to do this but I can't seem to get it...

thanks

Dinz · Post by **Dinz** » Thu May 24, 2007 12:34 pm

But What about I use "HARDWARE"

can i automate it in CC ???

I dont find comfortable automation it in the arrangement table.

and Can I change LFO Shape in CC ??

Thanks

friend_kami · Post by **friend_kami** » Mon Apr 07, 2008 3:55 am

conny wrote:This may help?

USB device is midi ctr source.
Midi Yoke 4 is used for external control in, USB is not set so in prefs.

// C

so yeah, i was looking for some info on this today again when this thread came along. so i just thought id drop by to say that you only need one track actually.

heres my io routing:

and heres my.. umm.. midi track.

arm it, and youre good to go.
works like a charm, except that you have to press stop before mapping stuff if youre playing a sampled midi clip at the same time obviously.

edit: in case youre curious about my hercules routing, my hercules is sending through bomes midi translator to midi yoke 1, and is beeing picked up by my midi track as a remote (output to yoke 2 as remote then) input in conjuction with my other devices.

elt.net · Post by **elt.net** » Mon Apr 07, 2008 10:11 pm

heu sorry where is the tip ?
links seem to be dead...

please.

friend_kami · Post by **friend_kami** » Tue Apr 08, 2008 11:53 am

elt.net wrote:heu sorry where is the tip ?
links seem to be dead...

please.

read what i just posted. thats the tip, only difference is that its using one track instead of two.

just set it up properly and youre good to go.
that is:
input from yoke: remote, out put to yoke: track.
make a midi track, monitor on, or arm it, then send the output to your yoke.

in my case i have incoming midi from my bomes translator thats coming from midi yoke 1, and i want to resample it so i have to enable yoke 2 for remote output and track input, then i make a midi track which i then arm and set the output to yoke 2.

all done and done.
one thing to notice with this setup however is that if you do not arm, nor set monitor to in on your midi track, you will not send any midi to live whatsoever, since its beeing captured by yoke 2 and is set to remote control live with yoke 2.

elt.net · Post by **elt.net** » Tue Apr 08, 2008 12:12 pm

heu sorry. i was tired and didn't see.
thx.
it works well.
but it's imposible to record CC0 (first fader of the faderfox LV1)...

another way i did a plugin for that: http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic. ... 953#673953

zi · Post by zi » Sun Jan 11, 2009 5:51 am

[+_+]

zi · Post by zi » Mon Jan 12, 2009 3:01 am

ok, now it works!
it didn't work for me because i had my automap server on, which was probably causing a conflict...
if you use automap and come across this problem: try switching automap off, and disable it in the midi control surface preferences.

there might be a way to keep automap running using the midipipe application: http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/mac/16154
i didn't try because as i'm going to sell my remote SL soon ...

bog · Post by **bog** » Thu Apr 23, 2009 4:28 am

zi wrote:ok, now it works!
it didn't work for me because i had my automap server on, which was probably causing a conflict...
if you use automap and come across this problem: try switching automap off, and disable it in the midi control surface preferences.

there might be a way to keep automap running using the midipipe application: http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/mac/16154
i didn't try because as i'm going to sell my remote SL soon ...

so does this mean Novation automap is not compatible with the virtual midi port solution for recording automation in session view?

how to automate CC's within ableton

missing link?

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