Future NI TRAKTOR going the live way

[Tarekith]

For all that Maschine does right, there's still a lot of things that can only be done with the mouse. So no matter how the hardware looks to get you away from typical computer interactions, it's always something you need to eventually go back to.

[beats me]

Am I alone in thinking NI needs to take a breather for awhile? At least in the hardware department? It feels like the S4 controller came out 6 months ago…and then the S2….and then this. Then there’s Maschine and Maschine Mikro. This shit ain’t cheap. At the very least drop all the options at once and then take a break. It’s really annoying when they drop a flagship which might be more than some people need but they buy it anyway because it’s the only option and then months later NI releases a watered down and cheaper version that would have worked for them in the first place.

[delicioso]

For all that Maschine does right, there's still a lot of things that can only be done with the mouse. So no matter how the hardware looks to get you away from typical computer interactions, it's always something you need to eventually go back to.

I don't know about "a lot". There's only a handful of obvious things that has to be done with mouse/trackpad/keyboard like drag &drop, importing and tagging samples, naming projects...etc. because it makes more sense. Everything else can really be done from just the hardware. There's really nothing else comparable in the software world that let's you get away from the typical computer interactions more than Maschine.

[lethal_pizzle]

then months later NI releases a watered down and cheaper version that would have worked for them in the first place.

If we're talking Maschine then Maschine and Mikro were released 2.5 years apart.
With the S4/S2, all the big manufacturers are now releasing 2 and 4 deck controllers.
The S4 was pretty much the first 4 deck controller to hit the market, and I can see why NI would only release the one controller to start with (as it was their first full blown effort). There were plenty of 2 deck alternatives around at the time.
As fot this latest effort - a year ago Traktor didn't have any sample decks so releasing it at the same time as the X1 (actually released 2 years ago) would have been pointless.

[beats me]

then months later NI releases a watered down and cheaper version that would have worked for them in the first place.

If we're talking Maschine then Maschine and Mikro were released 2.5 years apart.
With the S4/S2, all the big manufacturers are now releasing 2 and 4 deck controllers.
The S4 was pretty much the first 4 deck controller to hit the market, and I can see why NI would only release the one controller to start with (as it was their first full blown effort). There were plenty of 2 deck alternatives around at the time.
As fot this latest effort - a year ago Traktor didn't have any sample decks so releasing it at the same time as the X1 (actually released 2 years ago) would have been pointless.

I’m seeing it more as a calculated move to milk as much money out of the user as possible on a piece of hardware and when sales start dipping they release a variation. Between audio interfaces and controllers I don’t think NI has ever released multiple configurations at the same time, and this type thing is well mapped out in advance.

I can’t really tell what’s going on with the screen shots and video for the new controller. It looks like another side add-on, but then there’s the computer monitor-ish/hardware display shot above the decks which makes it look like competition for the S4 unless they are doing a complete redesign of the Traktor UI and that is in fact on the computer monitor. But it looks a little too crisp to be on a computer monitor.

[droidmike]

You know, guys, I don't know what the big fuss is all about when it comes to Traktor. For making beats and noise, I guess it's okay, but I think it would way too clumsy and inadequate when it comes to writing and composing music. It's just a controller with a lot of buttons and knobs. Give me a keyboard and a DAW any day.

[beats me]

You know, guys, I don't know what the big fuss is all about when it comes to Traktor. For making beats and noise, I guess it's okay, but I think it would way too clumsy and inadequate when it comes to writing and composing music. It's just a controller with a lot of buttons and knobs. Give me a keyboard and a DAW any day.

It's DJ software.

[JuanSOLO]

...I think it would way too clumsy and inadequate when it comes to writing and composing music. It's just a controller with a lot of buttons and knobs.

You "think" but you dont know fer sure. AND, my point is not the controller, it's the midi editing capabilities. Whether you are creating something for performance workflow, or production workflow, the ideas implemented in Traktors midi editor is a brilliant idea. IF this idea was adopted by other companies, you would see a shit ton of people posting midi maps that you could use to increase performance production and fun. AND you could customize your own stuff with little effort and get the most out of your gear.

It's DJ software.

With a midi editor thats amazing. I'm not trying to be PRO NI here, I'm just trying to point out the idea behind this. If Live were to implement anything similar we would all benefit from it greatly.

I think because it's DJ software it gets over looked by people who use Ableton, and like my self dont really care much to see Ableton be more of a DJ platform. I want Live to be what it is, with midi editing the likes of Traktor.

[beats me]

...I think it would way too clumsy and inadequate when it comes to writing and composing music. It's just a controller with a lot of buttons and knobs.

You "think" but you dont know fer sure. AND, my point is not the controller, it's the midi editing capabilities. Whether you are creating something for performance workflow, or production workflow, the ideas implemented in Traktors midi editor is a brilliant idea. IF this idea was adopted by other companies, you would see a shit ton of people posting midi maps that you could use to increase performance production and fun. AND you could customize your own stuff with little effort and get the most out of your gear.

It's DJ software.

With a midi editor thats amazing. I'm not trying to be PRO NI here, I'm just trying to point out the idea behind this. If Live were to implement anything similar we would all benefit from it greatly.

I think because it's DJ software it gets over looked by people who use Ableton, and like my self dont really care much to see Ableton be more of a DJ platform. I want Live to be what it is, with midi editing the likes of Traktor.

I love Traktor and I think it does a lot more than people give it credit for, especially in the on-the-fly department.

My short and sweet response was because droidmike seemed to miss the point of what Traktor is on a basic level. And after a reread maybe he meant to say Maschine instead of Traktor because “For making beats and noise, I guess it's okay” doesn’t make a lot of sense if you’re talking about Traktor. Actually most of what he said doesn't make sense.

[droidmike]

You're right. I read Traktor and thought Machine. Sorry. My bad.

[delicioso]

For making beats and noise, I guess it's okay, but I think it would way too clumsy and inadequate when it comes to writing and composing music. It's just a controller with a lot of buttons and knobs. Give me a keyboard and a DAW any day.

Maschine is not "just a controller with a lot of buttons and knobs". It's a viable alternative to Live's session with a dedicated controller with unmatched level of integration and advantages like recording clip automation. There are good reasons why it has taken over like it has. And you can use it with a MIDI keyboard and it integrates seamlessly with DAWs. It's ideal for people who don't enjoy using a mouse to make music and would rather have a hands-on hardware workflow.

[JuanSOLO]

no doubt Maschine does a lot and has a kick ass work flow, but I would hardly say it integrates seamlessly.

I quickly found a few things that I was amazed it didn't provide as well as some annoying quirks and ditched. Coming from Live only set up, I felt Live I was trying to choose between Live and Maschine for a lot of things I do better/faster in Live. That said, it has automation recording, and thats a lot of fun, and makes shit sound GREAT!

[droidmike]

Sorry that I diverted this thread thru an error (brain fart) by mistaking Machine for Traktor, but I'm a little annoyed at NI right now for having discontinued Kore 2, and not supporting it in Komplete 8. Having said that, my needs are simple, I guess. I write notes and harmony and arrange them in time; and yes, that includes drums and percussion. For me, using Machine would get in the way by needlessly complicating things and adding yet one more layer of technology to get in my way. I'm not a dj, and I don't perform, so I don't need to keep firing off clips and twisting knobs for a screaming crowd. When I need to do that in my compositions, the APC-40 and Launchpad work fine.
However, I can truly see the value of Machine for djs and performers, and yes, even producers, too (I was actually tempted for a while there). I just don't want to give NI Any more money than I have to. And it won't make my music any better.

[humnumb]

no doubt Maschine does a lot and has a kick ass work flow, but I would hardly say it integrates seamlessly.

I quickly found a few things that I was amazed it didn't provide as well as some annoying quirks and ditched. Coming from Live only set up, I felt Live I was trying to choose between Live and Maschine for a lot of things I do better/faster in Live. That said, it has automation recording, and thats a lot of fun, and makes shit sound GREAT!

Yeah, Maschine is still in its infancy at 1.7 and certainly isn't a "full featured DAW". It does integrate seamlessly depending on which workflow approach you take since it's so flexible in how you can integrate it to your existing setup.

[JuanSOLO]

I didn't find it seamless for the workflow I wanted, and I didn't wanna pick someone elses. AND I didnt want that many steps between Maschine and Live. So for now I will concentrate my efforts in M4L, Bomes, and Live.