Live 9 likely launch date...?

Discuss music production with Ableton Live.
golemus
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Re: Live 9 likely launch date...?

Post by golemus » Wed Mar 07, 2012 4:28 pm

Evengy wrote:why should they rewrite live? doesn´t it working in the most cases? =D there will ever be bugs in software.
I can assure you from 2 years of intensive experience with Live8 that it absolutely does NOT work in large portion of cases (at least if you are heavy user of plugins in Windows and there are definitely loads of those). I mean I am coming crazy with this program :D

And i've filed for the last 1-1.5 years loads of bug reports to the forum and sent tens and sent tens, maybe even a few hundred of crash dumps to Ableton in email and nothing of essence has been repaired in the 8.x.x. updates.

sebrov
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Re: Live 9 likely launch date...?

Post by sebrov » Wed Mar 07, 2012 7:33 pm

golemus wrote: I can assure you from 2 years of intensive experience with Live8 that it absolutely does NOT work in large portion of cases (at least if you are heavy user of plugins in Windows and there are definitely loads of those). I mean I am coming crazy with this program :D

And i've filed for the last 1-1.5 years loads of bug reports to the forum and sent tens and sent tens, maybe even a few hundred of crash dumps to Ableton in email and nothing of essence has been repaired in the 8.x.x. updates.
well i use windows xp and i have had 25 crashes/bug reports submitted for Live 8 in the 2 years i've had the program and i use it virtually everyday. No crashes yet with 8.2.8. I realise i haven't had the problems others have but if your having troubles you should opt in to send your usage data to ableton rather than spending time complaining here.

Also make sure all your vsts are up to date.

H20nly
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Re: Live 9 likely launch date...?

Post by H20nly » Wed Mar 07, 2012 7:36 pm

^ stop being so logical. the grass is always greener on the other other side!! this thread calls for speculation and disdain with a dash of hope and a dose of blame.
LoopStationZebra wrote:it's like a hipster commie pinko manifesto. Rambling. Angry. Nearly divorced from all reality; yet strangely compelling with a ring of truth.

sebrov
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Re: Live 9 likely launch date...?

Post by sebrov » Wed Mar 07, 2012 8:04 pm

H20nly wrote:^ stop being so logical. the grass is always greener on the other other side!! this thread calls for speculation and disdain with a dash of hope and a dose of blame.
ok then to get on topic, i've heard its being launched on the 12th of december to ensure all bugs with windows 8 and mountain lion are ironed out. beta testing is kicking off on the 1st of august, initially invite only to those that have submitted the most crash reports as you have the worst systems.

enough trolling though, i would like it if ableton's blog was like the building windows 8 blog. filled with information on exactly what they're building and why. that kind of interaction has been missing here since the launch of 8, when staff would regularly enguage with the users on here.

regretfullySaid
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Re: Live 9 likely launch date...?

Post by regretfullySaid » Wed Mar 07, 2012 8:13 pm

filled with information on exactly what they're building and why. that kind of interaction has been missing here since the launch of 8, when staff would regularly enguage with the users on here.
I really wish they did that.
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Tone Deft
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Re: Live 9 likely launch date...?

Post by Tone Deft » Wed Mar 07, 2012 9:00 pm

Bitwig wrote:
filled with information on exactly what they're building and why. that kind of interaction has been missing here since the launch of 8, when staff would regularly enguage with the users on here.
I really wish they did that.
In my life
Why do I smile
At people who I'd much rather kick in the eye?
-Moz

regretfullySaid
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Re: Live 9 likely launch date...?

Post by regretfullySaid » Wed Mar 07, 2012 9:40 pm

Yeah, yeah, still though...
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Tone Deft
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Re: Live 9 likely launch date...?

Post by Tone Deft » Wed Mar 07, 2012 10:50 pm

and this statement

"filled with information on exactly what they're building and why. that kind of interaction has been missing here since the launch of 8, when staff would regularly engage with the users on here."

simply isn't true.

they've been quieter than usual but there really isn't anything interesting going on in the forum. questions from new users, windowlickers going on about Live 9 and Apple threads.
In my life
Why do I smile
At people who I'd much rather kick in the eye?
-Moz

H20nly
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Re: Live 9 likely launch date...?

Post by H20nly » Wed Mar 07, 2012 11:17 pm

@ sebrov - that's the spirit!!


i heard that they are actually re-releasing Live 7 and packaging it as Live Classic. it will be released on April 1st.

it's all an attempt to buy more time until they release Live 10. which they will have to do... so that when someone does a search for Live 9 they don't get 65,000 results, the first 64,006 of which being threads speculating about or demanding Live 9.
LoopStationZebra wrote:it's like a hipster commie pinko manifesto. Rambling. Angry. Nearly divorced from all reality; yet strangely compelling with a ring of truth.

Machinesworking
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Re: Live 9 likely launch date...?

Post by Machinesworking » Wed Mar 07, 2012 11:56 pm

Well it's just frustrating for a lot of people that Ableton aren't an open company when it comes to release dates or product development.
It's obvious that this is a standard practice in the industry, but when a company goes for years almost releasing an upgrade a year, then goes well over two years without announcing anything more than "we're working on it" what do people expect besides a ton of threads going "WTF is up with Live 9?"

NI set up timelines for feature updates on their forums, this was implemented after horribly failing to keep to their projected updates and upgrade path. They announced new features for Maschine well before it's launch date or even the publicly known beta started.

Again, MOTU announce DP8 for sometime in Spring, it's not a guarantee that it actually comes out in Spring, but most likely it will hit stores at the very least before the end of Summer. MOTU customers don't know all the new features just some, but they have an idea of what is going on.

Bitwig Studio is announced, the big "new" features for a DAW are showcased, beta testing hasn't started, the release date being a brand new DAW is still up in the air, but potential Bitwig customers have a roadmap and an idea of what to expect.


Meanwhile Ableton Live customers are in the same boat as Apple Logic users, with a three year old DAW and no roadmap. Personally I think in this case, Apple isn't a good company to model. In fact I think it's logical to complain a bit, the fact is the secrecy IMO isn't helping Ableton one bit. I know personally if I had a clue as to the direction Abeton was taking Live, and it looked good, I would be less likely to be thinking about what the price of a crossgrade to Bitwig Studio will be.

I mean besides the guy holding a gun to your head forcing you to read through another "WTF where's Live 9?" thread what is sinful about not liking a policy that isn't being undertaken by Ableton's competitors? If it were an across the board thing that all DAW companies gave out no information about upcoming releases then I could see why people are upset at the constant Live 9 threads, but far too many of the DAW makers and plug in developers are more inclusive about their progress than Ableton, and none stopped the upgrade schedule as abruptly.

For instance 64 bit. Cakewalk released a beta of 64 bit Sonar years ago. Ableton have to be working on it, but unlike x86 OSX they haven't announced any roadmap for it, and it's obviously going to come in a paid upgrade at this point. It's not super frustrating for me, but that's because a good 64 bit machine is still months away for me, and I have knowledge that DP8 is going to be 64 bit. That just isn't the case for some people.

Anyway all I'm saying is be patient with people, it's not entirely their fault they get frustrated with what is not a DAW wide policy of total secrecy. :|

H20nly
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Re: Live 9 likely launch date...?

Post by H20nly » Thu Mar 08, 2012 12:07 am

^ You nailed it!:
H20nly wrote:this thread calls for speculation and disdain with a dash of hope and a dose of blame.
that's how its done boys.

*golf clap*
LoopStationZebra wrote:it's like a hipster commie pinko manifesto. Rambling. Angry. Nearly divorced from all reality; yet strangely compelling with a ring of truth.

Tone Deft
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Re: Live 9 likely launch date...?

Post by Tone Deft » Thu Mar 08, 2012 12:44 am

if they were to announce features for Live 9 there would be a stake in the ground causing some people to say they won't get Live 9 because of the announced features some people say they will get it, then there's the 'meh' crowd that will stick with Live < 9.

if you don't announce you still have everyone talking about Live 9 but you're not creating a crowd of people that hate it before it's released.

wait and let Bitwig show their cards, get them commit to something. in the meantime throw money into R&D and come up with a killer product to cockblock Bitwig and continue to differentiate Live from the competition.

not to mention letting the team chill the hell out after a hectic Live 8 bug fix session.


I've seen the constant release cycle (we call it Sprints) in my area of work, it's a good way to keep a team rolling with planned features in small increments over a long period of time. it's a shitty way to work and it leads to bad code because you're always onto the next feature, there's no time for scoping, planning, architecting and cleaning up as you go. engineering work doesn't translate to short term goals very well, this shit can blow up, you don't know how difficult a problem is to solve until you start to tackle it. the 'mushroom' way is much better. tell the team what they need to design them leave them alone for a year while they do it, just make sure someone good is at the helm.

/rant
In my life
Why do I smile
At people who I'd much rather kick in the eye?
-Moz

Machinesworking
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Re: Live 9 likely launch date...?

Post by Machinesworking » Thu Mar 08, 2012 12:55 am

Yeah that all makes sense from a business and solid development stand point, but you have a whole slew of companies who are dealing with the meh and disappointed crowds and announcing their roadmap. DP8 with Windows support and mostly new plugins is a great example of that. Personally I can only justify it if I get a good 64 bit machine, most of the new features aren't doing it for me, but the guys using huge orchestral libraries and a ton of Windows users are excited.

It's a choice Ableton has made, but it's not one everyone is going to like or understand, that's all I'm saying.

Tone Deft
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Re: Live 9 likely launch date...?

Post by Tone Deft » Thu Mar 08, 2012 1:44 am

hold up a second...





people are whining on the internet??

say it ain't so!!
In my life
Why do I smile
At people who I'd much rather kick in the eye?
-Moz

Machinesworking
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Re: Live 9 likely launch date...?

Post by Machinesworking » Thu Mar 08, 2012 2:38 am

Tone Deft wrote:hold up a second...





people are whining on the internet??

say it ain't so!!
:lol:
Yeah that's how you see it I guess. Thing is companies listen to end users. NI didn't change their policy until their forum was a veritable wasteland of angry customers.

I just kind of see it like this:

On one side you have customers who hope wish and complain that Ableton will do something to change their policy, and there are examples where a company did listen.
They litter forums with calls to arms etc.

On the other side you have customers that know how hard it is to develop and keep up a complex piece of software, and the potential downfalls of giving a roadmap etc.
who get tired of the constant whinning of the other side.

I dunno, it just seems to me Ableton are way past due for a beta announcement? last year I would and did call Live 9 thread, 64 bit thread starters out as being arrogant and jumping the gun etc. This year Ableton are starting to seem like Opcode if you know anything about what happened to Studio Vision you know what I mean. It took them approximately three years to sink. I know you're hedging your bets. Noticed you already signed up for the Bitwig fan forum. :wink:

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