Ableton 7 it's a joke !!!

Discuss music production with Ableton Live.
hoffman2k
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Post by hoffman2k » Sat Oct 06, 2007 1:48 pm

We'll get there Angstrom. Even if we have to kidnap/brainwash one of those Abe's.. We'll get there!

I dunno what you had planned for the holidays, but instead of snowboarding... Lets go water-boarding!

This'll be in the license of Live 8:
"No animals where harmed during the making of this software. However, one of our French employees got tortured and severely beaten during the implementation of CC recording in Session view"

Angstrom
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Post by Angstrom » Sat Oct 06, 2007 1:53 pm

yes, I think the problem must be that the Ableton staff don't work long enough hours.
Introduce 25 hour days for everyone!
All yachts must return to harbour


anyway - I do think the basic upgrade is worth £68
Anyone feeling rich can get the other stuff if they feel the urge.

nihad
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Post by nihad » Sat Oct 06, 2007 3:04 pm

[quote="PiLLO"][quote="nihad"]why shouldn't all in one users be professional?[/quote]


i don't think that! i think there are a lot of users that have their own instruments, so these users need major improvements on the software itself not on the suite or plugs i think...[/quote]


BS, so users who release records made exclusively in Live on a regular basis are not professional enough for you?

leedsquietman
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Post by leedsquietman » Sat Oct 06, 2007 3:31 pm

Pillo - if you feel this way about Live 7, I can only imagine the disappointment you felt in Live 6 and 5 and 4 and 3. You must have been gutted. In fact, given the fact that you hate the shortcomings in Live 7 so much why on Earth did you buy Live at all?

Comparing to Logic. Logic is a totally different program, most of what makes Live a brilliant program is the freedom to create and innovate outside the linear timeline, the live performance tools etc. I understood that when I bought Live 6. I have Cubase for x,y,z tasks and Live for a,b,c tasks with the possibility of using rewire if I want to combine.

However, I have been growing tired of Cubase for some time, the arrogance of STeinberg and have been praying for automatable time signature changes, sidechaining, better audio and midi, video export etc. This means I can reduce my usage of Cubase to a minimum. And if I had Logic it would be the same, no matter how nice it's synths and plugins are and it's plethora of key commands etc, composition and arrangement in it is still a lengthy, dull, pig of a mission compared to using Live.
http://soundcloud.com/umbriel-rising http://www.myspace.com/leedsquietmandemos Live 7.0.18 SUITE, Cubase 5.5.2], Soundforge 9, Dell XPS M1530, 2.2 Ghz C2D, 4GB, Vista Ult SP2, legit plugins a plenty, Alesis IO14.

3phase
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Post by 3phase » Sat Oct 06, 2007 5:25 pm

a joke? this one seems to be a solid update...

I just would have liked to see it much earlier... instead of live 4... ;-)
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paradiddle
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Post by paradiddle » Sat Oct 06, 2007 5:27 pm

I haven't tried the beta yet but the only thing I'm disappointed with the update is the 128 limit thing. At least we should be able to select which parameters we want to automate even if the limit is 128.

Some of my wishes came trough like the time sig, sidechaining, multiple lane, slicing. Rex files is a nice little addon. Drum racks look like the shit, can't wait to try that out.

friend_kami
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Post by friend_kami » Sat Oct 06, 2007 7:21 pm

paradiddle wrote:I haven't tried the beta yet but the only thing I'm disappointed with the update is the 128 limit thing. At least we should be able to select which parameters we want to automate even if the limit is 128.

Some of my wishes came trough like the time sig, sidechaining, multiple lane, slicing. Rex files is a nice little addon. Drum racks look like the shit, can't wait to try that out.
agreed on the drumracks aye.

but i think the OP forgot something very important:

track grouping.

last week i was working on a remix with a friend of mine. due to the fact that i could group my tracks, i had 4 tracks (baseline, synthline, percussions and vocals) on 4 different tracks set to monitor "on".

after that i had 34 tracks in total with different sections of the track with different mastering and effect setups.

additionally, i also had 6 tracks for effects and another 4 send channels.

sure i rendered them out as much as i could, but all those little parts needed separate tracks most of the time.

at one point i had a total of 43 tracks on my screen, every tracks except the 4 main groups and the effect tracks were dragged in to its minimal space (that is, the play/stop button only). right there i felt that if only i could assigne these tracks to a group, then hide the contents of that group, that would not only save me a bigass headache trying to figure out what track goes where, and where the hell that sepcific synthline track were (clever naming indeed, but really..), and also save me alot of screen space. so that i could for instance open up the tracks so that i could see the knobs, and the meters fully, for level analysing and whatnots.

instead, i ended up make 5 different als files, mastering them all separatly, rendered them out separetly, before making a new live-set with these newly rendered files and continued there.

do note that this was after deciding on the arrangement, which was entirely done in session view, and slightly edited in arrangement view.

heres a screenshot after some optimisation and whatnots, in session view, while mastering the groups a bit, before final editing and render:
as you can clearly see, track groups are needed.

i know this belongs elsewhere, but im drunk so i blame it on that fact.
somewhat related to the UI thread though.

i had to photoshop the picture to make room for all the tracks.
enough said, really.

the TTTTT tracks goes int he percussion groups (or track in this case), the V in the vocals group and so on. the X is the FX tracks, which needs to be separate during this particulare screenshot, due to some painful cut n paste and destroy editing.

ohyeah, did i mention that rendering the whole file out, then playing back the rendered samples in arrangement view, gives me dropouts? -.-

so i had to do it this way.
Image

now if you excuse me, ill go find the right forum for this. hah.

glu
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Post by glu » Sat Oct 06, 2007 7:41 pm

going from Live 5 to 7- it's no joke. It's a pretty kick ass update. I can't wait, even if I just get the poor man's DL.
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Silicon/Silicium
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Post by Silicon/Silicium » Sat Oct 06, 2007 9:18 pm

One more year to wait for a new chance to get automation recording in session... It's annoying, simply, especially because we don't have any words from the baes about this one. But hell, what about being LIVE and being unable te record what you make... LIVE!

Igor L
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Post by Igor L » Sat Oct 06, 2007 10:29 pm

leedsquietman wrote:Pillo - if you feel this way about Live 7, I can only imagine the disappointment you felt in Live 6 and 5 and 4 and 3. You must have been gutted. In fact, given the fact that you hate the shortcomings in Live 7 so much why on Earth did you buy Live at all?
Seriously. The only joke is the thread title itself.

mcconaghy
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Post by mcconaghy » Sun Oct 07, 2007 12:42 am

My disappointment, reading the specs, comes from what seems to be Ableton neglecting the original concept of Live as an instrument. We've seen Live grow from a sequencing instrument to "yet another DAW", and for someone using Live to perform I'm not feeling the love anymore. Performance just hasn't been right since Live 3, with it still being tolerable in Live 5.
I'm hoping that the Abe's haven't neglected the Session view in L7, I'm looking forward to trying it out, but there is the possibility that the upgrade path may have ended for me. Here's hoping that 7 can bring it.
ethios4 wrote:One thing to remember is that you will probably never ever get to experience your own music the way you experience other people's music.
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Tone Deft
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Post by Tone Deft » Sun Oct 07, 2007 12:45 am

goddamn you guys are negative...

beware the haters who never post but show up to cast widely negative, ill-informed, sweeping generalizations about Live. *cough*trolls*cough*
In my life
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At people who I'd much rather kick in the eye?
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deva
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Post by deva » Sun Oct 07, 2007 1:44 am

Silicon/Silicium wrote:One more year to wait for a new chance to get automation recording in session... It's annoying, simply, especially because we don't have any words from the baes about this one. But hell, what about being LIVE and being unable te record what you make... LIVE!

You can record automation in session with any plug-in that has its own midi learn. All the stuff I want to automate does have midi learn so this is not a problem for me. Once I purchased Live, I made sure the main 3rd party plug-ins I purchased had this.

This is quite workable.

Also, racks can fold up now, and unfold. This can allow quite a few previous tracks to be consolidated.Not track folders, but it does help. And of course once you can fold one thing, it is not long for general track folders to get there too

friend_kami
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Post by friend_kami » Sun Oct 07, 2007 3:30 am

deva wrote:
Silicon/Silicium wrote:One more year to wait for a new chance to get automation recording in session... It's annoying, simply, especially because we don't have any words from the baes about this one. But hell, what about being LIVE and being unable te record what you make... LIVE!

You can record automation in session with any plug-in that has its own midi learn. All the stuff I want to automate does have midi learn so this is not a problem for me. Once I purchased Live, I made sure the main 3rd party plug-ins I purchased had this.

This is quite workable.

Also, racks can fold up now, and unfold. This can allow quite a few previous tracks to be consolidated.Not track folders, but it does help. And of course once you can fold one thing, it is not long for general track folders to get there too
7th generation, and its still not there. not even a hint that it will be there either.

its alsmost as supid as propellerheads and their wait til R4 before they include an arpeggiator.

you think that L8 will bring track folders? possibly another cycling74 disappointment, if anything..

money>vision.

eyeknow
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Post by eyeknow » Sun Oct 07, 2007 9:35 am

Angstrom wrote:yes, I think the problem must be that the Ableton staff don't work long enough hours.
Introduce 25 hour days for everyone!
All yachts must return to harbour
But do YOU have the proper time dilation software for that? AND why isn't it in live yet? :lol:

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