Lock-up w/extreme distortion at CPU~70%

ethios4 · Post by **ethios4** » Wed Nov 22, 2006 10:13 pm

I have been having this problem every since upgrading to v6.

In previous versions, as I would approach the limits of my CPU (~70-80%) Live's output would get more and more crackly until it was unbearable.

In Live 6, playback is mostly fine until some sudden arbitrary point (~70-80%) when everything suddenly sounds extremely time-stretched and the interface completely locks up until it registers me hitting the stop button or turning off the audio interface. This makes it very annoying to work on a complex project because it takes anywhere from 1-7 minutes to regain control of Live when the sudden lock-up happens.

I have tested this on 2 systems now, one with the Presonus Firebox and the other with MOTU Ultralite.

John Daminato · Post by **John Daminato** » Sat Nov 25, 2006 10:42 pm

Uhmmm dude, 70-80% is pretty heavy. After like 50-60% to me live becomes unbearable. If your in the 50-80% zone all the time, the first thing I would do is look to upgrade your cpu. If thats not possible, start freezing then flattening tracks that are using tons of plugs. Live is some what of a unique program and IMO isnt reall super efficient like Cubase or Logic. But those programs are not time stretching every track all the time so its like comparing apples and oranges.

One other thing that might work is adding a more efficient chip cooler. THe heat pipe ones are nice (cheap) but you need to make sure they will fit before you buy. LIve is probably causing your chip to throttle and over heat. If you get a the chip cooler you can over clock it and maybe save your self some money on upgrading to a new cpu.

ethios4 · Post by **ethios4** » Sun Nov 26, 2006 6:23 pm

yeah, I know 70-80% is quite a heavy load....I'm not complaining that Live starts to freak out under such a load, but I am complaining about the way it freaks out.

In previous versions Live would start acting up more gradually so I could stop playback and adjust accordingly. With v6, Live acts fine until an arbitrary point when it completely locks up and is unresponsive for several minutes while making a horrible sound. With the CPU meter fluctuauting as much as it does (eg, going from 30>80% within <1s) it becomes very frustrating to work when the consequence of going over the arbitrary limit is such a severe interruption. I just liked the old behavior better, and I am wondering why v6 behaves the way it does.

The other thing that is strange about this to me is that I went through the helpful lesson on configuring the audio interface. Using the CPU load test, I set my latency so that an 80% load was fine. I was having these problems, so I have increased my latency to 4x the optimal value for the test load, and still I have this problem at CPU loads <80%. Perhaps a momentary spike (too short to be picked up by the CPU meter?) causes the lockup.

I freeze tracks extensively, but the limitation quickly becomes the load my hard disk can handle. That is why I suggested the faux-RAID setup in Feature Wishlist - spread the hard disk load across several drives dynamically.

I guess my base frustration is that system limitations become a problem so quickly. I am only working with 15-20 tracks, but I cannot really go beyond that because either my CPU is overloaded, or everything is frozen but can't all be read because of disk load. Seems like I should be able to have more than 15-20 tracks without the system going from fine to completely locked up in a single instant.

As for my system, I just put in an new hard drive in my laptop (the fastest drive available for laptops) and have a fresh and minimal install of XP, Live, and a few plugins.

Does anybody else experience this new behavior in Live6?

John Daminato · Post by **John Daminato** » Wed Nov 29, 2006 2:00 am

So you dont even have any plugs running, just 15-20tracks of naked audio?

Now that you mentioned this problem in more detail. I have ran across this. Where all of the sudden the cpu meter spikes out of control. I did figure out what this problem was but I cant remember now since it never happens anymore. Actualy on my new pc it will happen on long sessions. My assumption was that the cpu was getting hot. I couldnt figure it out with the 5 fans built in. Then I realized 3 of the fans werent running due to the fan control being pluged in the wrong slot on the motherboard. Since that, no problems. Make sure there are no other programs running in the backround. Once melodyne in the backround was causing me probs.

I would seriously look into getting heatpipe cooling for your chip and a way to monitor the temp. I believe ONce the chip reaches a certain temp it will begin to throttle and or automatically lowers its load to cool off. Maybe this is wats causing these crazy cpu spikes.

BASSbüro · Post by **BASSbüro** » Wed Nov 29, 2006 10:40 am

@ ehtios 4

short question: i've also an motu ultralight with ableton live 5. the outputs in live are 11 & 12. but how you get the testtone to configure the interface? when i activate the testtone, i can't hear anything.....

John Daminato · Post by **John Daminato** » Wed Nov 29, 2006 2:45 pm

Look on your motu. Maybe its routing the testone to a different set of outputs. I have a motu 828mkII and strange things like that happen sometimes.

BASSbüro · Post by **BASSbüro** » Wed Nov 29, 2006 3:10 pm

ok, i'll try this @ home. but believe me or not: since i work with this motu ultralight i have troubles all the way. fuckin' oddity thing.

and guess what, with my cheap on-board soundblaster-soundcard, ableton 5 or 6 runs much better....he, he.

cheers,
thom

ethios4 · Post by **ethios4** » Wed Nov 29, 2006 4:24 pm

I used the test tone with my Presonus Firebox setup, so I have not encountered the problem with the ultralite 11/12 test tone issue.

I am not hitting the CPU spike and lockup problem with 15-20 tracks of naked audio....I have to freeze everything to keep the spikes from happening! The problem I run into with 15-20 frozen tracks is that the hard drive can't cope with that much audio.

Again, the issue I'm raising is the way Live handles a heavy CPU load. It is inevitable that the CPU load will become to great and tracks will have to be frozen, but Live now locks up instantly when the threshold is crossed. Previous versions allowed a bit of leeway to stop playback before lockup occured.

Perhaps it is a cooling problem....I never encountered this with previous versions of Live, however, which leads me to believe something changed with the way Live handles heavy CPU load. I'll check into cooling/throttling issues. Thanks!