seriously MIDI is damn slow and un-precise. no wonder using the crossfader in live is still an absurd dream.
what alternatives do we have people??? anyone out there used OSC? does it even work with Live (without Max patches or anything like that)? are there any OSC-capable interfaces out there? (lemur is, right?)
i mean its pretty demented that we've come so far with computer music (Mega Kilohertz recordings, insane processing) but we still interact with it in the slowest / clumsiest way.
what do we know? who do we talk to?
lets break some legs!
I am through with MIDI!
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rbmonosylabik
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Re: I am through with MIDI!
Feel that way for past 20 yearsboraxx wrote:seriously MIDI is damn slow and un-precise. no wonder using the crossfader in live is still an absurd dream.
what alternatives do we have people??? anyone out there used OSC? does it even work with Live (without Max patches or anything like that)? are there any OSC-capable interfaces out there? (lemur is, right?)
i mean its pretty demented that we've come so far with computer music (Mega Kilohertz recordings, insane processing) but we still interact with it in the slowest / clumsiest way.
what do we know? who do we talk to?
lets break some legs!
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tomperson
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Midi sucks, it's completely from another era, but it seems it'll be a while before we have full OSC on anything but a few apps out there.
Turn up the radio. Turn up the tape machine. Look into the sunset up ahead. Roll the windows down for a better taste of the cool desert wind. Ah yes. This is what it's all about. Total control now.
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tomperson
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Word. Given current data transfer/processing rates (you can transmit real time video through the LAN!) its ridiculous the amount of latency midi protocol has...And the amount of data it transmits is minimum given today standards....
Turn up the radio. Turn up the tape machine. Look into the sunset up ahead. Roll the windows down for a better taste of the cool desert wind. Ah yes. This is what it's all about. Total control now.
I rarely use MIDI, pretty much i just play parts live and record the audio. If I need to manipulate the performance, I just do it with the audio file. Much faster, less intermediary steps.
tarekith
https://tarekith.com
https://tarekith.com
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tomperson
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And no need to talk in español!!!Tarekith wrote:If I need to manipulate the performance, I just do it with the audio file. Much faster, less intermediary steps.
Seriously, I don't use much midi also, but the "real" musicians (those that play keyboards and stuff like at speeds of typewriting) suffer like pigs with the latency. And even doing simple stuff like controlling pots and faders, it's there. You can sense it. The thing moves onscreen, but with latency and not nearly as smooth as it ought to be. Damned.
Last edited by tomperson on Fri Sep 15, 2006 2:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Turn up the radio. Turn up the tape machine. Look into the sunset up ahead. Roll the windows down for a better taste of the cool desert wind. Ah yes. This is what it's all about. Total control now.
I never use midi in Live, I just shake my fist at my controller and it mentally implants my notes & shit in Live.
GO VEGAN!!! - Macbook Air, Bass Station II, Some Korg shit, Live Suite, U-He, Audio Damage, Microtonic, Ohmicide, more soft stuffs, awesome controllers, euro rack modular synth,an awesome cat.
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noisetonepause
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Goodmorning, world. I see you've helped yourself to some coffee.
Now, let's get moving.
OSC is the best alternative, yeah, but I think Max and Reaktor are the only two big apps running on mainstreram operating systems to support it (although Ardour which runs on Linux and OS X does too, I think, but then it doesn't host virtual instruments yet), but these are still fringe apps so there's no real incentive for manufacterers to make OSC devices... and when there are no devices, there's no reason to support it in software.
Now, if only a company with a little sense and foresight as well as the market share to make it worthwhile would change this situation. As far as I see it, there's only one company which fits that description!
One thing, though. Making MIDI controllers is simple. You can buy the plugs and the chips and the elves and the thingmagiks needed for less than the cost of a pack of blackmarket Marlboros (which you really shouldn't buy anyways, they're horrible things - but now you know what to do with the money), but for OSC you need an ethernet interface and some software in the controller. Component costs are higher and R&D costs are higher... There won't be any fifty quid OSC keyboards for a good few years BUT this just means we won't see the M-Audio/Behringer of OSC controllers soon either. So it may be a good thing.
Anyways, since OSC can also be used to transmit goodness and tiny bits of musical honey over a network, it would make sense to implement it in software first. The controllers will come, I'm sure of it.
Now, let's get moving.
OSC is the best alternative, yeah, but I think Max and Reaktor are the only two big apps running on mainstreram operating systems to support it (although Ardour which runs on Linux and OS X does too, I think, but then it doesn't host virtual instruments yet), but these are still fringe apps so there's no real incentive for manufacterers to make OSC devices... and when there are no devices, there's no reason to support it in software.
Now, if only a company with a little sense and foresight as well as the market share to make it worthwhile would change this situation. As far as I see it, there's only one company which fits that description!
One thing, though. Making MIDI controllers is simple. You can buy the plugs and the chips and the elves and the thingmagiks needed for less than the cost of a pack of blackmarket Marlboros (which you really shouldn't buy anyways, they're horrible things - but now you know what to do with the money), but for OSC you need an ethernet interface and some software in the controller. Component costs are higher and R&D costs are higher... There won't be any fifty quid OSC keyboards for a good few years BUT this just means we won't see the M-Audio/Behringer of OSC controllers soon either. So it may be a good thing.
Anyways, since OSC can also be used to transmit goodness and tiny bits of musical honey over a network, it would make sense to implement it in software first. The controllers will come, I'm sure of it.
Last edited by noisetonepause on Fri Sep 15, 2006 4:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Suit #1: I mean, have you got any insight as to why a bright boy like this would jeopardize the lives of millions?
Suit #2: No, sir, he says he does this sort of thing for fun.
Suit #2: No, sir, he says he does this sort of thing for fun.
well i tried OSC some time ago for a MAX patch thing, but i honestly cant remember if it was faster or not. so my question is, is OSC really the shit? whats the resolution (better than the 7 bit hell of MIDI hell im sure), whats the speed? im sure i could google them answers but i'd rather have a friendly face hit me with the facts.