playing ableton at a live show.

Pitch Black · Post by **Pitch Black** » Mon Feb 27, 2006 11:28 pm

Sorry, I could have been clearer,

There are two sorts of "VST's": VST plug-in effects such as reverbs. delays etc. and VSTi's which are plugin software MIDI Instruments such as Stylus/Crystal/Reaktor etc.

An audio clip will use less CPU than any VSTi (thats VST instrument) so if you are using VSTi's you could still record them to audio clips and still send them to effects. That will save you some CPU.

These "effects" could be Live's built-in ones, or VST (note no "i") effects plug-ins. Unless the VST effects you are using are very specific, could you swap the for some of Live's built-in effects which are very CPU-efficient, just for live gigs?

Sorry dude, i have to run out the door now... catch ya later

LeoMANXVII · Post by **LeoMANXVII** » Mon Feb 27, 2006 11:34 pm

Pitch Black wrote:Sorry, I could have been clearer,

There are two sorts of "VST's": VST plug-in effects such as reverbs. delays etc. and VSTi's which are plugin software MIDI Instruments such as Stylus/Crystal/Reaktor etc.

An audio clip will use less CPU than any VSTi (thats VST instrument) so if you are using VSTi's you could still record them to audio clips and still send them to effects. That will save you some CPU.

These "effects" could be Live's built-in ones, or VST (note no "i") effects plug-ins. Unless the VST effects you are using are very specific, could you swap the for some of Live's built-in effects which are very CPU-efficient, just for live gigs?

Sorry dude, i have to run out the door now... catch ya later

this is such a great concept. like it's perfect and i am so glad that you are helping me out.
thanks so much. basically i understand completelly.
like i can render all my audio with effects that i will not be tweaking like eq's etc. and i can just let them run though the tweakable vsts during a show.
thankis.

kennerb · Post by **kennerb** » Mon Feb 27, 2006 11:57 pm

Pitch Black wrote:Sorry, I could have been clearer,

There are two sorts of "VST's": VST plug-in effects such as reverbs. delays etc. and VSTi's which are plugin software MIDI Instruments such as Stylus/Crystal/Reaktor etc.

An audio clip will use less CPU than any VSTi (thats VST instrument) so if you are using VSTi's you could still record them to audio clips and still send them to effects. That will save you some CPU.

These "effects" could be Live's built-in ones, or VST (note no "i") effects plug-ins. Unless the VST effects you are using are very specific, could you swap the for some of Live's built-in effects which are very CPU-efficient, just for live gigs?

Sorry dude, i have to run out the door now... catch ya later

Hey Paddy,

Didn't you have a link showing your super sets and how you configured them. I can't find a reference to it here or in my mail but I am almost positive you had something up. I'd love to have that link again (and the design to your flightcases)

PS hope you had a great honeymoon!

Pitch Black · Post by **Pitch Black** » Tue Feb 28, 2006 4:31 am

Hey Ken, I don't have the mega-set example posted anywhere (if anyone can host it, PM me, its about 2.5MB) I just email it to anyone who wants it (again, PM or email me).

Ken, I can't find yr email addy, write me bro and I'll hook you up.

As for the roadcases, well they're homemade around this system of modular aluminum shelving here: www.ullrich-aluminium.co.nz/furnprts.htm Hopefully you can find a simillar system in the US.

Its just 1 inch square aluminum tube that has all these different moulded plastic joiners/end pieces/corner sections/whatever you wanna call 'em. They cut the tube to length when you buy it, so you just show up with a cutting list and say, "I want these 12 lengths of aluminim (nice powder-coated black finish) and 8 three-way corner inserts, please". The corner inserts knock in with a hammer and stay there by friction.

It's an amazing system, you can build gear racks, projection screen frames, coffee tables, even keyboard stands out of this stuff.

Re the road cases, they are built around a flat square of tube that sits in the bottom half of the case (there is a matching flat square in the top lid of the case, too). You take the lid off the case, remove the contents (in our case, our 24ch mixer), then put the 4 vertical poles into each corner of the bottom section. They fit onto the upright spike of the 3-way corner moulding. Then you put the lid on the top of the vertical poles et voila: the techno tea-trolley.

As you've seen, you put all your messy wiring in there and you can roll on/roll off stage all pre-patched and powered up. You just run a long extension cable to the stage power supply in advance. Just dont let anyone unplug you, or worse, plug you into a lighting dimmer-pack - it HAS happened.

Very good for festivals, we patch up side of stage or backstage, power up and check, then roll onto stage and connect audio L/R into the DI boxes or DJ Mixer or whatever and away we go.

I don't have a very good photo anywhere of a trolley, but here: http://www.pitchblack.co.nz/upimg/big_d ... hi-res.jpg you can just see (lower centre) a corner of the upright pole going into the lid that the mixer is sitting on. Hopefully that = 1000 wds.

cheers,
paddy

PS Had a great honeymoon! I've just bought my first gardening implements - wierd, I didn't think the transition to married life would be so immediate!

azart · Post by **azart** » Fri Apr 28, 2006 9:22 pm

Thank you Pitch Black!

I was wondering how I should work out my 45 minutes to 60 minutes set!
All in one set seems it might be the way!

Beyong the technical aspect, I wa reading a guy who said sets should be built in one track anyway! So that you ready to switch according to the audience mood!

Thanks

Peace!

azart

fzero · Post by **fzero** » Mon May 01, 2006 6:49 am

LeoMANXVII wrote:i've had 2 shows but i noticed what i tend to do is play my original songs one by one. so my transition is just a big pause between my loading of my next ableton file.

it's kind of newbish. =/.

what would you guys do?

I used to have the same problem, but live itself provides a solution (at least if you have live 5).

I use live since v1. Up to v4 I used to make some big-ass sets with 4-5 songs on the same session. Some loops were shared between them, but they were different songs nonetheless. During the load time I used a Korg Electribe S with some previously beatmatched patterns and samples from the sets to keep unity (BTW, you can also do this using a CD or any other thing that makes some noise while you load another file).

So far so good, but this is what I used to do.

Live 5 allows you to drag a whole set to the current session without stopping the audio. This is absolutely great, but when you drag a REALLY big set (like the ones I used to make), Live freezes until the set is completely loaded. The sound continues to play, but you can't really do anything while the set is being merged with the current session.

To get rid of this problem, I went on and re-organized eveything. Instead of huge sets, I chopped everything into small sessions, each containing a song or a group of related samples. This way I can start with any song/bpm and make up the order as I go.

For this to work right, I follow some simple rules:

1. The live template with which I start has nothing but control and key assignments plus fx returns - no samples. Everything else is dragged inside. I start with just 4 channels, which have several controls mapped to my Trigger Finger. These channels are generally used for loops, acapellas and fully mixed tracks. The sets themselves are loaded to the blank area, so every channel is created on the fly recalling fader positions and insert effects.

2. There are always two return tracks with the same effects on every micro-set. Both are filter+delay chains, basically because I love delays.

If a different effect is needed, I add it as insert.

3. I save all files using the "[bpm] descriptive name.als" format (e.g. "[163] Mean breakbeat grooves.als"). This way you always know what you're looking at and if you'll have to improvise a bridge between the songs. I also save every set self-contained to make backups easier.

4. Extremely complex arrangements are a pain in the ass in a live situation. If you have a complex track, render it and then find loop points in the mixdown. Render some other individual loops if needed, but keep it simple. You want to play and improvise live, not take a bajillion of channels and loose yourself scrolling sideways looking for that pesky loop. The general rule is to keep separate elements only if you are actually going to use them.

5. Finished loading a new set? See if you still need the samples from the old one. Delete the channels with unused stuff to keep Live lean.

Doing things this way, it's possible to play nonstop for hours (even days!) as long as you have something to drag inside. Works fine for me - plus, now I can use the Electribe synced via MIDI to do something more useful.

Schizophonix · Post by **Schizophonix** » Tue May 02, 2006 12:16 pm

Hello! I recently started an identical thread about changing the set without interrupting the audio... check it out...

http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=37478

however the conclusions where the same, I should do a mega-set and include alll my tunes in there, which seems like an impossible task given the complexity of my tunes...

Fzero had a really interesting idea, I had not thought of this before, I am sure it is not as simple as it seems but sounds like a good workaround. I am going to try it as soon as I can and give my feedback...

Take care

playing ableton at a live show.

Thank you

Re: playing ableton at a live show.