Next beta arrived! Live 5.0.3b6!

Post by **Alex** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 1:24 pm

Hi Aton,

please provide us with more information about this problem.
- Do you get these pops and clicks also with the built in soundcard?
- Do these pops and clicks seem to depend on the CPU usage or does it also happen when playing a simple set with only one audio clip?
- Do you own a previous version of Live that not has these problems on the same system with same preferences and same Live set?
- Do you use a MackieControl or A MIDI controller that works in MackieControl mode?
- When you record the master out via resampling, are the clicks and pops visible in the recorded file?

Hi Obineg,

I can absolutely understand that this must be frustrating but we need to find a way to reproduce this somehow, which seems easy for you but not for us.
So we have to find a way that we can do here the same as you do.

So you computer hardware is:
- Imac g5 2ghz 1gb ram, 10.4.3
- Powerbook g4 876mhz 640mb ram, 10.4.3

- Do you use always the built-in sound or do you use an external audio interface?
- Do you use an external MIDI Interface?
- Do you use a MackieControl or A MIDI controller that works in MackieControl mode?

- When you record the master out via resampling, are the clicks and pops visible in the recorded file?
- Do you get the clicks also in an simple Live set containing only 2 playing audio clips without any effects?

Feel free to drop me an email with this information as it makes a bit easier to handle.

regards,
/Alex

Cryptic UK · Post by **Cryptic UK** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 3:26 pm

Would just like to know does any one at ableton use live? or are you just counting on customers testing it for you.

come on im sure your rakeing in the money now, spend it on some better programers and test your own products.

lola · Post by **lola** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 3:50 pm

Cryptic UK wrote:Would just like to know does any one at ableton use live? or are you just counting on customers testing it for you.

come on im sure your rakeing in the money now, spend it on some better programers and test your own products.

Tsk Tsk....

Ableton can not fix it without the help of their testers.
There are 100's of different configured daw's with lots of different hardware.
I am glad they choose to get help from their customers, Ableton is for me the only company that realy listens to their customers.

Hope for u that u dont own a Native instruments product.

jimmyalba · Post by **jimmyalba** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 3:52 pm

Cryptic UK wrote:Would just like to know does any one at ableton use live? or are you just counting on customers testing it for you.

come on im sure your rakeing in the money now, spend it on some better programers and test your own products.

F****n' ridiculous comment, what better way to test software than communicating with the users of your product.

Meef Chaloin · Post by **Meef Chaloin** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 4:18 pm

jimmyalba wrote:
Cryptic UK wrote:Would just like to know does any one at ableton use live? or are you just counting on customers testing it for you.

come on im sure your rakeing in the money now, spend it on some better programers and test your own products.

The only thing i have to say about this is that I hope they take their time with the tests rather than rushing to meet deadlines.
Alex made one comment about hoping to get it out by xmas... well i'd say release it when its ready, beta test it thoroughly. I think everyone would rather wait a few weeks/month extra if it means they will be able to fix more.

Please please just take your time with it, get it rock solid (i tried the last beta and was quite impressed, seems a lot better performance wise, and I seem to be getting a lot less pops/clicks although i havent really pushed the beta yet).

Cryptic UK · Post by **Cryptic UK** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 4:19 pm

yep wasnt saying this was a bad thing for customers to test, was just questioning as to wether or not they test it themselves as most of the problems would happen on any sort of hardware or computer. they seem to be oblivious these problems unless one of us report it, some of these problems arent hard to recreate

ya na what i mean liiiiiiiiiiiiiiike

Post by **Alex** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 4:34 pm

Meef Chaloin,

Alex made one comment about hoping to get it out by xmas... well i'd say release it when its ready, beta test it thoroughly. I think everyone would rather wait a few weeks/month extra if it means they will be able to fix more.

The important point for the release data is the question if the contained bug fixes and improvements introduced any side effect bug compared to Live 5.0.2 or not.
If we would have 9 bug fixes, why we should wait for for the 10th if that would mean to wait an unknown time?
If we would release Live 5.0.3 next week it does not mean we would not release another bug fix update at the beginning of next year or whenever we have fixes.

So I prefer to release what we have instead to wait for something we might have someday.

regards,
/Alex

bildeaux · Post by **bildeaux** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 5:06 pm

Have him check what type of RAM he is using in his MAC. The older powerbooks cannot use DDR2 and act strange (the powerbooks before October). Probably not the issue, but could be something to look at. Apple said if you use RAM other than specified, Apps will behave badly and have issues similiar to the CPU spikes, etc.

I would prefer Ableton to have a QA department, then release to customers. Would be more stable.

b.

microgroover · Post by **microgroover** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 5:39 pm

I'm highly doubting that the ableton are just trying to rake in the money.. But, as someone said before, DAWs come in x^y different configurations.. Impossible to test.. That's why they do open betatesting to find problems!

I have Ableton 5.0.2 on both my desktop and my laptop.. Works perfect on my laptop but can do unexpected crashes an CPU-spikes on the desktop.. So.. No fault in the software, probably the hardware and / or configuration..

Am I wrong here? Perhaps there should be an OPEN buglist?

Cryptic UK · Post by **Cryptic UK** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 6:04 pm

read what i said im not saying beta tesing is bad. id say its good that we can test it and find out problems, but id like to know what problems ableton have found themselves.....

its not hradware or confiurations its bad programing. how come cubase works perfect?

Post by **Alex** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 6:15 pm

Hi folks,

it makes not sense to dispute if a problem is hardware related or software related or both.
I do not ask user for their hardware configuration because I want to blame the hardware. I do this because we need to find a way to reproduce the problem a user has reported.
There is also no black and white about testing. And of course we do testing internally but it we also made the experience that beta user feedback is extremely helpful. Finally testing itself is very big field on its own. Just make an web research fro something like "software testing" and you will find thousands of papers and ideas about it.

Cryptic UK,

please take the time to explain as detailed as possible with which hardware configuration you do what and what exactly happens.
Feel free to drop me this as email as it would make the handling easier.

regards,
/Alex

peeddrroo · Post by **peeddrroo** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 6:17 pm

Cryptic UK wrote: how come cubase works perfect?

maybe because steinberg is almost 30 years old?

on the other hand, how come Word still has bugs?

Obineg · Post by **Obineg** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 6:18 pm

microgroover wrote:DAWs come in x^y different configurations.. Impossible to test.. That's why they do open betatesting to find problems!

Macs don't come in that many configurations , if you have a recent g4 powerbook, a recent ibook, a recent imac and a recent powermac you've pretty much covered it.

if they give similar results using the built in soundcard I would pretty much assume that those results would be universal over the mac line . . .

Then again , thats just my bigoted theory.

Cryptic UK · Post by **Cryptic UK** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 6:26 pm

kuniklo · Post by **kuniklo** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 7:18 pm

Cryptic UK wrote:read what i said im not saying beta tesing is bad. id say its good that we can test it and find out problems, but id like to know what problems ableton have found themselves.....

its not hradware or confiurations its bad programing. how come cubase works perfect?

Wow. You're the first person I've ever heard say that Cubase works "perfect". Browse around on their forums for a bit and you'll see that people are much more frustrated with Cubase than people here are with Live.

Next beta arrived! Live 5.0.3b6!

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