delay

clipperer · Post by **clipperer** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 1:21 pm

yesterday i posted in propellerheads forum:
-------------------------------------------------
once i already posted something like that, but ppl didnt see what i ment probably.
i did some tests with delay unit in reason 3.
as you can see in ms mode there is only 2000 numbers but to get perfect sync there must be 999.999 numbers cause maximum tempo in reason is 999.999.
you can check it if you put delay to ms mode, then change main tempo a bit, say it was 145.523 and you change it to 145.524, and then put back to step mode and then back again to ms mode, and youll see that ms numbers havent changed.
you can also hear it if you play metronome and some delayed sounds when delay feedback is set to 127.

probably it wont be fixed and probably people arent that critical about things.
but anyways thanx for reading
-------------------------------------------------
today i post this here cause i think the same thing is happening with live.

am i goin' overboard with this ?
the fact is as i hear that our favourite sync option is actually offsync
pls tell me im missing smthing....

Machinate · Post by **Machinate** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 1:49 pm

I think you need to explain this a bit further. The difference between 145.523 and 145.524 is something like 3 millionths of a second per beat, if i'm not wrong.

and which delay unit did you use in Live? could you explain the rationale behind switching between synced and un-synced if you want sync?

clipperer · Post by **clipperer** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 1:56 pm

i messed with simple delay in live.
you cant be totally sure cause feedback in simple delay is maximum only when its 95%, i mean it wont be unlimited, it cant be 100% unfortunatelly.

what im trying to say is that sync mode in those units are not based on main tempo of the song but on seconds and milliseconds which automatically mens that it cant be synced perfectly.

so again, am i missing something ?

Here's Johnny · Post by **Here's Johnny** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 2:04 pm

clipperer wrote:yesterday i posted in propellerheads forum:
-------------------------------------------------
once i already posted something like that, but ppl didnt see what i ment probably.
i did some tests with delay unit in reason 3.
as you can see in ms mode there is only 2000 numbers but to get perfect sync there must be 999.999 numbers cause maximum tempo in reason is 999.999.
you can check it if you put delay to ms mode, then change main tempo a bit, say it was 145.523 and you change it to 145.524, and then put back to step mode and then back again to ms mode, and youll see that ms numbers havent changed.
you can also hear it if you play metronome and some delayed sounds when delay feedback is set to 127.

probably it wont be fixed and probably people arent that critical about things.
but anyways thanx for reading
-------------------------------------------------
today i post this here cause i think the same thing is happening with live.

am i goin' overboard with this ?
the fact is as i hear that our favourite sync option is actually offsync
pls tell me im missing smthing....

I think you need to get out a bit more often…

Machinate · Post by **Machinate** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 2:07 pm

what im trying to say is that sync mode in those units are not based on main tempo of the song

Yeah, that's pretty much how I understood your post, what I'm really wondering is how you'd know from a live plugin that the sync is done in milliseconds? You'd have to reverse engineer the thing.

I just tried feeding a kick sound into a simple delay set to 8/16ths delay, and fed it back into itself to get infinite feedback. It played for over three minutes without going out of sync.

clipperer · Post by **clipperer** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 2:22 pm

how did you fed it back into itself?

Machinate · Post by **Machinate** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 2:24 pm

make a send, put the delay in the newly made return and turn up the send knob on that. Add a saturator and a filter, and you've got some cool stuff going on...

clipperer · Post by **clipperer** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 2:32 pm

oh yes i think i saw it in henkes thunder video...

clipperer · Post by **clipperer** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 2:55 pm

oook. sorry for clipping but ive got something to compare.:

www.zone.ee/mixpage

there are 2 samples of the same thing.
one is secorded right after hitting play and second was recorded after some minutes.
i can definetly head that offbeat.

Machinate · Post by **Machinate** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 4:05 pm

...and it sounds like you have it set to 4, not 8, right? Also, what is the *real* problem about this? The shift you hear is probably just some internal latency from the send

clipperer · Post by **clipperer** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 5:17 pm

its not send latency i think, its delay offsync when set to sync.
metronome was set to 4/8 and delay set to 2.
as i said before people are not that critical maybe or something. but for me it matters.
i wouldnt say its a problem but its frustrating..

Machinate · Post by **Machinate** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 5:24 pm

clipperer wrote:as i said before people are not that critical maybe or something. but for me it matters.

well, you are searching out a problem that has no practical implications for you, aren't you? I mean, aren't you??

clipperer · Post by **clipperer** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 5:32 pm

heh. no.
i mean, who knows in what extremes will i fall with music. i mean everything matters..
and thats all

Machinate · Post by **Machinate** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 5:34 pm

well, yeah, everything does matter. your best bet would be to reduce the latency on your soundcard? maybe that has some impact on this?

clipperer · Post by **clipperer** » Tue Nov 15, 2005 5:42 pm

im nearly sure its not the soundcard latency

delay

delay

Re: delay