Analog Step Sequencing in Live 5.0

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booyah
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Joined: Fri Feb 04, 2005 1:53 pm

Analog Step Sequencing in Live 5.0

Post by booyah » Tue Sep 13, 2005 2:15 am

I was up last night till 2:00 am studying the Midi Editor in Live 5 to try and figure out a way to give the user more control and a feel that he or she is working with an analog step sequencer in Live and this is what I came up with. Its a simple solution one that can be implemented ASAP into the current version of Live. You team might already be exploring this option but if not then here is the idea. I just want to see it happen ASAP. I'm just given you every thing I have in my study of the midi editor from last night. I repeat my self a few times only to because I was trying to figure out the best way of conveying the idea. Thanks.

Simple solution that would give you an analog style step sequencer in Live.

This is a simple solution and could be implemented ASAP in Live 5.0.3 or 5.0.5. The solutReplyion for an analog style step-sequencing start with the Editing of MIDI Notes and Velocities. Example Live 5.0.1 now works like this' Switch to Draw Mode by activating the Control Bar's Draw Mode switch you can now have the ability to draw in note right but the problem is in draw mode it self. Draw mode is where the user need to be given the freedom to draw in notes up and down side to side without letting go of the mouse button from the start of the first note. Example select draw mode you now click the first note that you wish to draw in the Midi Editor you should not have to let go of the left mouse button to draw in the next note while still holding the left mouse button you should be able to draw in notes vertically to change their transposition, or horizontally to change their position in time without ever letting go of the mouse button so where ever you move the mouse in draw mode note are being drawn in while your finger is still on the mouse button. Live 5.0.1 now works like this MIDI notes into the Note Editor with the mouse. Deactivating Draw Mode allows notes to
Be selected and moved around by clicking and dragging, either vertically to change there
Transposition, or horizontally to change their position in time. This has to be a part of draw mode or make it a third draw mode) a real time draw mode setting to draw in note up and down side to side in draw mode without letting go of the mouse button until your done.

Clicking and dragging, either vertically to change there
Transposition, or horizontally to change their position in time. This needs to be a part of draw mode so that way you can hear the results in real-time and you would never have to let go of the left mouse button from the first note you could jump up down in note without ever letting go of that mouse button and the note would fallow and play back in real time. This would save time because you would not have to go back and forth in and out of draw mode and it would give the ability in draw mode to draw in so many notes without ever having to let go of the left mouse button. In draw mode where ever you move the mouse while holding down button one time notes would drawn in so you could be moving up down left and right and the note would be drawn in and you would hear changes in motes in real time you then let go of the mouse button and your done with your first line.

Solution that would give you an analog style step sequencer in Live.

Whenever your in draw mode right now in Live 5.0.1 when you left click the mouse and hold that left button down on the mouse you are only allowed to go side to side left or right this is not given the user the ability to have full access to what the midi editor is and should be capable of Ableton. There needs to be a third option in draw mode a real time draw mode of which when in draw mode you could go vertically and transposition, or horizontally to change their position in time in real time without ever letting go of the mouse button. This would give the live user so much more freedom and it would give you an analog style step sequencer feel of which would work great for coming up with quick line in real time. This would work much better in drum mode as well because in draw mode you could just move up and down and hear the results immediately without ever letting go of the mouse button from the start of the first note until you done coming up with your drum line or synth line. I think you get the idea now lets make it happen ASAP. Reply to let me know what you think about this idea. Thanks again Ableton team.


In a message dated 9/6/2005 5:21:43 AM Eastern Daylight Time, dave@ableton.com writes:
but we do have an audio preview function available in the MIDI (piano roll) view now with version 5. Sorry if I'm telling you something you know, but I recently discovered the little headphone icon there and my drum programming is getting better by the minute.

I see what you are talking and this will help big time but still the problem I'm running into is in draw mode it self, I still have to draw notes in the editor one at a time instead of just drawing in the first and never letting go of the mouse button moving the mouse up or down left or right and the notes would fallow the direction of the mouse until you let go while I'm in draw mode, notes would be placed in the editor in realtime. Think about this open up Live 5 drop in a midi instrument into a midi track click on the editor to start drawing in your notes (click the headphone icon so that way you can hear what going on with the notes). Now lets say you are not using the draw mode tool pencil on this example. Lets say you are in the first midi edit notes window, click your first note on C4 don't let go of the mouse button' now start moving up and down side to side as you make your way from left to right would it not be cool if all those notes that you just herd where draw in for you exactly as you just herd them instead of you having to go back in and drawing each note in you're self. It should work like that in draw mode where ever the mouse goes as long as you are holding the mouse button a note should fallow up or down left or right while in draw mode, now tell me that would not be the bomb. Try this and get back to me' Thanks for the reply.
PS your tip will help Sir. Thanks again.

Dave at Ableton asked me a question and can't remember what the question was but here is my response. After speaking with Dave he informed me that i should post my idea on the user forum ASAP.

All that's an easy one, go into the midi editor right click your mouse button in the editor away from all the notes, a little green window will now appear allowing you to choose many different setting' pick the 8th one down from the top it's says the narrowest setting for notes [done]. Next question I hope you are forwarding this info to the right persons who can make this happen. Reply. Thanks.

I would think that even a plug in like the one in Reason would be cool some thing like the Matrix and then a seperate plug-in for your drum sounds or some thing like SONICBYTES step sequencer and this would be a cool program but it doesn't work with Live. The idea needs to happen soon with Live can someone at Ableton make it happen. Thanks. :twisted:
Marco: Waldorf Q+, G5 Titanium, Spectralis, 2 Future Retro Revolution, Ableton Live 3.0.4, Sound Forge, Acid 4.0, Sample Tank, Athlon 64 bit.

Alien Leg
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Post by Alien Leg » Tue Sep 13, 2005 7:01 pm

I'd love to see step sequencing functions in Live!!!
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Angstrom
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Post by Angstrom » Wed Sep 14, 2005 1:57 am

Ok here's an ALPHA of a sequencer I made to use myself, but never released to the general public.

What this means is it's buggy as hell, but worth a try - you might be lucky! :)

Image

DOWNLOAD THIS PLUGIN [edit] new version is in RAR format and fixes a few bugs (hanging notes)


it's a plugin for windows only and will be released properly (IE with a manual and with less bugs) over the next month. You will have to figure most things out for yourself right now.

Important things.

1: extract the zip & put the .dll file in your vst plugins folder, wherever that is.
2: open Live 5, it will work if you know what you are doing in Live 4 .. but requires virtual midi drivers which I am not explaining here!
3: find AngstroSeq in the vst list and drop it on a midi track, call the track "seq" set 'midi in' to your main midi input
4: make another midi track and put a synth on it, on that track set the midi FROM "seq" and in the second drop down make sure you select "AngstroSeq" not 'track'
5: crucially - record arm both tracks, because you will want to send midi controllers to the sequencer and you want your synth to get the midi info



tip: once you have it working ... assign the filter of your synth to CC1 assign something else to CC2 .. now listen ... woooeee!!!!
If you dont want to use CC1 and CC2 the little boxes there are for changing the CC output number to your synth

I am happy to take bug reports, but I will ignore any really dumb questions , moderately dumb questions I will probably answer. Use your initiative and you should be able to figure it out :)


oh yeah midi CCs for the controls run from
0 .. the first pitch slider, to
64 .. the last CC

I think I assigned some other CC stuff to the loop length etc, you'll have to twiddle, there's a midi learn up there anyway.
Last edited by Angstrom on Wed Sep 14, 2005 4:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Clearscreen
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Post by Clearscreen » Wed Sep 14, 2005 3:52 am

i've been keeping a casual eye on your site angstrom to see if you'd ever release this after you mentioned it over there. i'll be happy to give this a go!

EDIT - are the switches over the cc selectors meant to turn the cc's on/off? if they are, they aren't working for me. otherwise it's a pretty cool sequencer! nice work mate!
Hp Elitebook 2.8Ghz. Live 7.0.14 & Live 8.1.5, XP Pro. and stuff...

Angstrom
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Post by Angstrom » Wed Sep 14, 2005 10:57 am

[edit] Ah I thought you meant the little draggable sliders for note lengths.
:)

the switches you mean .. I think they either quantize the CC or turn it off - I forget !


the white bars:
off, or no white bar .. is no note .. then increasing whiteness is incresing length - although it gets a bit strange when it goes fully white. I had plans for that which didn't really work out. (portamento in the tb303 style)

it is very flaky by the way - I think the 'stop/play' button and the reset button don't effectively end any hanging midi notes .. so that needs sorting.

The other sequencer ofmine I have been resurecting is the one you may be thinking of which is AngstroStepper, that's a bit different and comes with a synth. I've been finishing that off recently too.

booyah
Posts: 18
Joined: Fri Feb 04, 2005 1:53 pm

Analog Step Sequencing in Live 5.

Post by booyah » Wed Sep 14, 2005 1:46 pm

Thanks to all of you who replied to the idea. Your insight is very much appreciated. I would hate to have to go out and drop a lot of cash on a hardware step sequencer when I would think that in this new age of software synths and computer you would think that there would be more software analog style step sequencer on the world market. It seams that most music companies just have forgotten about step sequencing, it doesn't make any sense almost all the pro's use step sequencers to get good quick ideas out in a short time. I hope Ableton jumps on this idea, I would think that they would come up with something that could be used in real time in a Live setting. Just think about this Ableton team, lets say you save a nice sound with a delay, comp plug-in as you now can with Live 5 but lets say that you had a step sequencer plug-in in Live that you could save as well with the sound with a delay, comp plug-in that you could recall at any given time in a set boy the possibilities would be end less. You could have hundreds of step sequenced sounds on your hard drive ready to be called up at any given time for a Live show. Just drum patterns synth patterns, I even found a place for these patterns inside Live 5. Go into the Midi Live Editor there is a little tab that say Fold next to the little head phones icon right underneath you could drop in 3 more boxes one that would say drum patterns one for synth patterns and a save button that would save that pattern in one of the 2 banks of pattern so that way you could recall the pattern at any given time. Just an idea, any ways thanks to all I will try out this plug-in for now. Thanks again. [/b]
Marco: Waldorf Q+, G5 Titanium, Spectralis, 2 Future Retro Revolution, Ableton Live 3.0.4, Sound Forge, Acid 4.0, Sample Tank, Athlon 64 bit.

Angstrom
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Post by Angstrom » Wed Sep 14, 2005 4:14 pm

I uploaded a new version which fixes the main bug - hanging notes after 2 'off gates'


ALPHA 0.07 DOWNLOAD it's a rar this time because the zip was 1.5 meg and the rar is 0.9 meg.

enjoy it. :)

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