select on launch via MIDI

nyc_mark · Post by **nyc_mark** » Sun Aug 14, 2005 12:03 am

Midi Mapping F12 work around for now you could just use BMT. I'd like to see mapable "launch Mode" too, or at least key shortcuts so we could use BMT to translate from midi to key stroke. Is it "Live" or what? don't remove live jamming features and replace them with "Daw" features, come on now!

nyc_mark · Post by **nyc_mark** » Sun Aug 14, 2005 5:10 am

Keep the faith

wildcon · Post by **wildcon** » Thu Aug 18, 2005 4:31 pm

Ah Ha,

At last I've realised my problem.

Moving the Faderfox controller to a clip (when DJ'ing) and then triggering is fine, but when I press F12 to see the clip I get a totally different one.

This was / and is driving me frigging well nuts. Having to double click the mouse on the clip to see it is a real PITA.

Good to see I'm not alone on this one.

Come on Abes a solution or at least an explanation - please

quandry · Post by **quandry** » Thu Aug 18, 2005 11:08 pm

take the damn kid beyond video off of your site Ableton, you are seriously deluding customers into assuming the newest product, Live 5, can do proper live looping with just a midi foot pedal. Without "select on launch", it can't. Period. Unless you are perfect and NEVER make ANY mistakes. No one is that good for every song, every night they perform. We all make mistakes--to have to go on stage and know that you CAN'T make a mistake without having it get looped or having to stop playing your instrument and use the mouse is enough to make you f-ck up on stage just worrying about f-cking up. It's really frustrating to still be using 3 because of this glaring omission, which makes Live worthless as a live looper. Seriously, you are basically lying to (or seriously misleading) your potential customers with that video. Please do whatever you have to do to re-instate the "select on launch" that was present until version 3. Why it was removed, I'll NEVER understand, but the effect of its removal is the utter crippling of Live as a looper--dear God WHY???? PLEASE, a response of some sort would be nice--by version 6? as an update to 5 later on??
Throw us a bone, please.

Ryan

astar · Post by **astar** » Fri Aug 19, 2005 1:53 am

Best we can do is keep this thread near the top and hope at least we get some kind of answer eventually!

I think the Abletons must be on vacation after the long beta test (?)

supster · Post by **supster** » Fri Aug 19, 2005 2:36 am

adding another vote to this issue:

we absolutely have to be able to select the clip on MIDI launch consistantly

constantly resetting the focus with the mouse pointer is clumsy and destroys a lot of the instrument feel of the program

understandable if there was a problem at the last minute with this, but it really should make it in to an update asap in my opinion.

seems like a small detail feature, it isnt, it really badly affects how your workflow goes when DJing or playing a set
.

nyc_mark · Post by **nyc_mark** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 1:04 am

WildCon, having that faderfox you feel our pain even more since that is a very nice controller, having all those clip shot button's but the wrong clip in view, it ovious these features could be added(brought back live3) no problem, but the real question is why where they removed? On the kid beyond issue I really don't see why you would make him the live5 spokes person, first being live has mad daw funtionallity at this point, I mean effects, vsts, vsti, rewire, midi, instuments on it own. Kid is just using one aspect, that honestly live is begining to lack at this point, which is, a live looping instument. He's got skills but could just use this

http://www.sonicstate.com/news/shownews.cfm?newsid=1604#

and not lug around that laptop. By the way someone that uses live in its current state and to its fullest potential is Sasha, why not put up a video of him and show us how he uses that sick maven controller, I bet he uses a recoded version of live also to adapt to that custom rig. Live crashed on Sasha so always have a back up cd player or something, which he had of course. He reload his .als and was back up fast

quandry · Post by **quandry** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 1:39 am

nyc_mark wrote: Kid is just using one aspect, that honestly live is begining to lack at this point, which is, a live looping instument. He's got skills but could just use this

http://www.sonicstate.com/news/shownews.cfm?newsid=1604#

and not lug around that laptop. By the way someone that uses live in its current state and to its fullest potential is Sasha, why not put up a video of him and show us how he uses that sick maven controller, I bet he uses a recoded version of live also to adapt to that custom rig. Live crashed on Sasha so always have a back up cd player or something, which he had of course. He reload his .als and was back up fast

PSYCHE! I've owned and since sold my RC-20. It has MANY limitations compared to Live 3:

Mono
Only one "track" with overdubs on top.
Overdubs are not undoable.
No possibility of adjusting relative levels of individual tracks (or pans, effects, crossfader, etc.)
No built-in effects.
No crossfader or mutliple tracks to crossfade.
No customizable midi commands (i.e. only two pedals to control it, that's it)
Limited recording length, not so perfect sound.
No click through headphones or bpm readout tempos (thus VERY hard to get a perfect loop with, or you can play the horrible sounding click through the mains....

).
Etc., etc., etc.

The whole reason I found Live was getting fed up with the countless limitations of the RC-20, Line 6, and Boomerang Units. Even the $1000 Echoplex is nowhere NEAR as full-featured as Live. C'mon, Kid couldn't do anything close to what he's doing with the RC-20 in terms of effects and multiple recordings at once, multiple tracks with pans and volumes, custom control via mappings and Bomes, ......

All I was saying in questioning that video on their site now is that I find it hard to believe Kid is using anything but version 3 because of the select on launch issue and v4 and 5's requiring flawless perfection to do live looping--he's good, but we all want a safety net of deleting flubbed loops. I think it is great for Live to market itself as a looper--v3 is easily the best looper on the planet, and very underadvertised and underutilized as such, even in the midst of an ever-growing looping market. I just think its a shame that this little omission and the lack of midi mappable delete are standing between v 4 and 5 and sweet looping paradise.

In terms of Sasha as compared to Kid in terms of using the "fullest potential"--is Sasha doing live loops or just playing clips that are already recorded??? As a musician and audience member, I'd say someone doing live looping is using the software in a more potent and interesting way than just playing shit back and twiddling filters. Not trying to flame you or sasha, just disagreeing with the comparison of the two in terms of using Live to its potential.

Ryan

nyc_mark · Post by **nyc_mark** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 3:06 am

quandry
Maybe I did not explain my opinon on live's current and previous state
Live currently: Full blown out daw
Live previously: great looper
Live future: Full blown out daw, and great looper with said feature.

Maybe I did not explain my opinon on live's current and previous state
in regards to Kid Beyond and Sasha(for example)

Kid Beyond
Live currently: from what I've seen and heared not using any features added since live1
Live Previously: that's all he needs(probally using)
Live future: He could use some of the new features but still be able to live loop

Sasha
Live currently: from what I've seen and heared he using it to it fullest besides maybe instruments live. But he's definetlly using fades, effects, midi, vst, vsti, so on.
Live previously: wouldn't be enough for what sasha does in it previous encarnations
Live future: limitless(but your right, not sure if sasha would crave this feature as much because he's not doing what kid beyond is)

Let's just get this feature added people.................................I'm spent

quandry · Post by **quandry** » Mon Aug 29, 2005 2:06 am

nyc_mark wrote: Kid Beyond
Live currently: from what I've seen and heared not using any features added since live1
Live Previously: that's all he needs(probally using)
Live future: He could use some of the new features but still be able to live loop

I'd have to say your "live future" on this one is off--the point of my posts is that I highly doubt he is using anything past 3 because of the lack of select on launch and thus the lack of ability to delete a flubbed clip on the fly. I for one would sure like some word from Ableton on this, especially since it was supposedly in one of the 5 betas--WHY on earth is this crucial feature gone, especially given that the new midi transport controls only effect the selected clip, and most performers trigger clips via midi. It seems SO illogical to not have select on launch, it was an option in prefs. and didn't hurt anyone, WHY IS IT GONE ABLETON???? WILL IT EVER COME BACK??? It would be nice to know, cause if not I guess I can stop wasting my time here since I'll be stuck on version 3 forever.

Ryan

ap2 · Post by **ap2** » Mon Aug 29, 2005 2:11 pm

Another vote for select on launch.
It is impossible to dj'ing without it.
Would be nice to see it in 5.02 final ...

ben_blue · Post by **ben_blue** » Tue Aug 30, 2005 5:30 am

i have a lot of faith in the Abe's, who have brought us thus far, will continue, and get this going. they cant and wont ignore us, the users.

lets just keep this thread at the top, and remember to express our gratitude and keep understanding that theyre probably still worn out.

in ideas like this i think its great we keep talking and rehashing the idea and editing it, if u will. not that we're not already, but just sayin we can keep re-iterating the main points, and not get too far off into left field with ideas that this inspires.

with software as amaizng as Live, i know it will not be hard to make a midi mappable F 12. And, im sure there's reasons its not there, most of which probably involving coding and programming which i know squat about.

cheers
ben

supster · Post by **supster** » Tue Aug 30, 2005 5:43 am

ap2 wrote:Another vote for select on launch.
It is impossible to dj'ing without it.
Would be nice to see it in 5.02 final ...

yes, its not impossible, but its way more clumsy and annoying than it should be.

i think they would have fixed it by now if it were easy, there must be something more too it that they need to work out

but imo it really needs to be fixed in an update, cant wait till vs 6 (please)
.

nyc_mark · Post by **nyc_mark** » Tue Aug 30, 2005 10:45 am

As astar pointed out this feature was in Live5b16 and I have just confirmed in Live5b13, and worked just fine. Since this feature still work's if you use the mouse in Live5 final, I now believe it might actually be a bug in the mapping system. Can anyone think why they would have removed it, after using it in these beta's there's no problems at all so its a shame if they removed it for no reason. I have full confidence abes will have this fixed soon. At this point I'd like to see "Launch Mode" assignments, for gate, trig, etc...

mocker · Post by **mocker** » Wed Aug 31, 2005 9:10 am

Come on ! Could anybody answer us at Ableton, PLEASE ! Bug or feature disabled ? Thanx.