Composition *SHARE YOUR TECHNIQUES*

womoma · Post by **womoma** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 2:56 pm

Sometimes i'll spend time sampling shit and creating synth patches and building a library of sounds.

I think thats time well spent. I havent spent much time in the last month making tunes but Im getting far closer to refining and streamlining my setup just how i want it.

mosca · Post by **mosca** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 4:44 pm

i tend to make a new impulse kit or take a new simpler sample and then mess around and see where they take me.

failing that i have over 1000 classic breaks on my hard drive and if im stuck just drag one in at random and go with the flow

so that would probably come under the 'improv/jam' method

mosca

eisnein · Post by **eisnein** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 6:18 pm

i agree that this is a fun thread.

i am usually thinking of ideas and imging what they would sound like-
like recording my bass and putting it in a sampler and then throwing an arp on the sampler (Logic) and making a riff out that. sometimes ill start by programming a beat and then write on top of that.

i then typically come up with a solid core riff that gets my ass thinking and my brain moving and start thinking of arrangement and where i can go from there- chord changes, different sections, transitions etc.

also am a huge fan of not working when inspiration strikes but rather working as much as i can and not waiting around. this way even if you dont end up using what you worked on you know that idea doesnt work, or you just learned something. i equate it to a guitarist practicing and writing little riffs that may or may not turn into a song.

i have been trying to use the computer more and more as an instrument so i have been recording my "jams" to 4 track along with my bass and fx that i am playing, this works great in terms of figuring out what does and doesnt work for arrangments cause you know how it comes off live and has a feel and movement rather than just sequencer arrangments.

my thought is that it will be great when people can be called in as players for sessions on laptops (live remixing, slicing and dicing and synthesis), in the way that turntablist can be. (although i dont want Laptops to be the rollerblading to turntablists skateboarding, if that makes any sense)

gotta eat lunch, rant rant run on sentan......cc...............eee.......

Machinate · Post by **Machinate** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 6:34 pm

I see jamming as a specific type of composition, more concerned with the sub-conscious. When jamming people tend to instinctively hang on to the parts that work the best, thus the best parts crystallize and eventually they become if not the structure, then the *core* of a track.

I love jam sessions, I get the biggest kick out of going freestyle once in a while.

djadonis206 · Post by **djadonis206** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 7:46 pm

Inspiration starts of for me at a club watching a great DJ like Dan or Donald blow up - honestly I ask myself what would they play - they're friends and I like their music - tracky, hard funky - way out there progressive funky techno and house

then I go record shopping at the local $.50 record store and buy as many records with funky sleeves (can't listen to them) then I sit down and look for cool loops and breaks and sounds

record them into ableton and go from there referencing point one

Asking myself, would Dan or Donald play it - would I play it? Would my buddies play this? and would I play it?

saddam whosayin? · Post by **saddam whosayin?** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 1:55 pm

I have to respectfully comment

on one issue...
imo "jamming" is not something you do by yourself
its a "we" thing, not an "I" thing

it requires interaction with other people

usually with other musicans
but I would say a DJ who responds well to his crowd jams
and you can jam with visual artists and dancers

when I'm working by myself I tend to do sound design 1st, beat making 2nd and composition 3rd
looping those 3 element as necessary, tailoring my structure to the musical
goal I have in mind

Angstrom · Post by **Angstrom** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 3:07 pm

I generally compose a tune like this

1: find a classic record
2: sample a bar of the rhythm & repeat it endlessly
3: put a huge kick drum on top for that 'club' sound
4: get a sample of a famous vocalist, and take two meaningless words and repeat endlessly
5: add a low pass filter sweep to the mix occasionally
6: kill myself because I am poluting the audiosphere

I know a lot of people follow steps 1 to 5, but they dont continue to step 6 ... shame!

yes, I am joking.

sweetjesus · Post by **sweetjesus** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 3:29 pm

Angstrom wrote:I generally compose a tune like this

1: find a classic record
2: sample a bar of the rhythm & repeat it endlessly
3: put a huge kick drum on top for that 'club' sound
4: get a sample of a famous vocalist, and take two meaningless words and repeat endlessly
5: add a low pass filter sweep to the mix occasionally
6: kill myself because I am poluting the audiosphere

I know a lot of people follow steps 1 to 5, but they dont continue to step 6 ... shame!

yes, I am joking.

Thanks for the tips. May I add, I think it is crucial to not perform these steps backwards, otherwise you will NEVER get anywhere.

Patrick Turner-Lee · Post by **Patrick Turner-Lee** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 6:19 pm

Good question. I am new to Ableton and up til now I have got a rythym going. Jammed on to it, using quantize record on base lines to get a tight groove. Then I go back to the rythym and chop and change. Quite quickly I have got three or four different things going.

However I just realised that you can set up sections and switch between them to create song structures. Haven't got the hang of it yet but golly what a brill idea.

Patrick

Diskclaimer · Post by **Diskclaimer** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 7:11 pm

sweetjesus wrote:
Thanks for the tips. May I add, I think it is crucial to not perform these steps backwards, otherwise you will NEVER get anywhere.

ok... *that* was funny

2bad · Post by **2bad** » Fri Apr 01, 2005 3:16 pm

Very interesting thread to me as I've never actualy completed a track, I have a shed load of half finished tracks and have been trying to make music for several years.
I find it very hard buliding a structure and have reached the point where it feels more like a mental block, I'm hoping one day I'll finish a tune and the flood gates will burst open. Anyway thanks for the tips and I'll be putting them to good use.

hoffman2k · Post by **hoffman2k** » Fri Apr 01, 2005 3:24 pm

The best advice that worked for me, for finding a song structure...

Take some songs you like and have a look at the waveform.
Write down how many bars sections have. (intro 8 bars - beat 30 bars - start break 2bars - build-up 8 bars -................)
Write whatever works best for you.
After i tried this method, most of my tracks actually get finished.

cheers

supster · Post by **supster** » Fri Apr 01, 2005 3:34 pm

2bad wrote:Very interesting thread to me as I've never actualy completed a track ...

I find it very hard buliding a structure and have reached the point where it feels more like a mental block.

hoffman is right: if you're stuck, dont try and reinvent the wheel.

Drag wavs of songs / tracks you like into Live, warp them, and look at the waveform.

The structure of the track is laid right out in front of you, there's no guessing ... if you want to analyze it in detail, you can ..

Then apply this structure to a track idea of yours. eventually you will get to the point where - in a lot of cases (not all .. hehe) you will instinctively feel where the track needs to go next.

best scenario is when you are in some random place and you hear where its supposed to go in your head. those inspiations often turn out to be the best ones, because your brain has structured it in your subconsious and its feeding the best ideas back at you.

.

Angstrom · Post by **Angstrom** » Fri Apr 01, 2005 3:56 pm

2bad wrote:I've never actualy completed a track, I have a shed load of half finished tracks and have been trying to make music for several years

You just need deadlines rather than any serious techniques, join a band or go on a tour. Knowing that you have to perform 'something' for an hour in a couple of weeks time sure focuses the mind on finishing stuff off!
I bet you could cobble an arrangement together without a book in sight.

It doesn't have to be a work of genius, allow yourself to fail. Aim for perfection by all means, but don't reject it if it isn't 'perfect'.
The song structures I was most proud of passed peple by, the simplest things that took me 5 minutes - and they damn loved them!

I have one track thats about 15 mins long that is just a Reaktor device which I made then fooled about with. I edited it up and laid some 'filler' stuff under it in Live ... everyone loves it , yet it only took about an hour to record, 'arrange' and master!

zekrab · Post by **zekrab** » Fri Apr 01, 2005 4:10 pm

2bad wrote:Very interesting thread to me as I've never actualy completed a track, I have a shed load of half finished tracks and have been trying to make music for several years.

Exactly the same for me. Finishing a track is very hard, althought i've been making computer based music for 4 years. I've read books, magazines giving advices but... I think it is because i don't have a precise goal in mind when composing. I still have difficulties to translate ideas i have in mind to concrete sounds and structures...

So any advice there?