Looper discussion

nowtime · Post by **nowtime** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 1:41 am

Machinate wrote:I fucking LOVe this little critter, supremely cool action, very quick, and not hard like the "stomp" type from Roland, for instance. internal polarity switch thing.

http://www.dv247.com/invt/4858/

Yeah, I like the soft stomp feel of this unit, too. But it is lightweight and tends to jump around and upside down in the heat of the moment. You could attach it to a base for more stability. I like the Boss FS-5U because I can connect multiple units together.

http://www.zzounds.com/item--ROLFS5U

cmreal04 · Post by **cmreal04** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 2:05 am

http://www.zzounds.com/item--ROLFS5U

http://www.zzounds.com/item--TCHMM1

But do you need to connect this to an instrument or midi controller to use it ? or can you just connect it directly to your interface and control the looper that way ? There's only midi inputs on my mpd 24.

CM

illsub1 · Post by **illsub1** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 2:07 am

Get a cheap USB keyboard, rip off some keys to make some space, andadd rubber to the bottom and on top of the keys still there. Now you've got plenty of switches for your feet much cheaper and smaller footprint than your fcb

bendybones · Post by **bendybones** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 2:58 am

illsub1 wrote:Get a cheap USB keyboard, rip off some keys to make some space, andadd rubber to the bottom and on top of the keys still there. Now you've got plenty of switches for your feet much cheaper and smaller footprint than your fcb

dang, you beat me to it!
Although the roland pedal posted is a great price.
i can imagine the feel that it has by the look of it.
Here's another
http://www.dv247.com/invt/6574/

bland_handl · Post by **bland_handl** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 7:30 am

Angstrom wrote:...there's no foolproof way of determining what you are thinking of as you play one 4 second burst of notes. Was that 120 bpm , 60 bpm ? 240 bpm ?

It just makes a good guess at it. It's really intended to get you up and running in a freeform manner, I think it's not appropriate if you are just going to play 32 bars of improve and then segue into your languid pre-prepared breaks. Because, of course, if you were intending to bring in a pre-made bassline or some loop underneath then there could be problems if they leap in at 240 bpm under your mid-tempo loop.

In this example you're starting the performance with a live loop, and the global tempo is being set when by what you're looping. So far no pre-recorded loops have been triggered, so if you notice the global tempo has been miscalculated by a ÷2 or *2, surely it'd be easy to implement a [÷2 and *2] button that would re-calibrate the global tempo after live's guess before you drop the pre-made material? Maybe a hidden midi-assign button up near the global tempo readout.

bland_handl · Post by **bland_handl** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 7:31 am

Hey, while I'm fantasizing here, why not make that anyway - and add an % amount that would determine how quickly it changed to the new tempo !

Machinate · Post by **Machinate** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 9:34 am

bland_handl wrote:
Angstrom wrote:...there's no foolproof way of determining what you are thinking of as you play one 4 second burst of notes. Was that 120 bpm , 60 bpm ? 240 bpm ?

It just makes a good guess at it. It's really intended to get you up and running in a freeform manner, I think it's not appropriate if you are just going to play 32 bars of improve and then segue into your languid pre-prepared breaks. Because, of course, if you were intending to bring in a pre-made bassline or some loop underneath then there could be problems if they leap in at 240 bpm under your mid-tempo loop.
In this example you're starting the performance with a live loop, and the global tempo is being set when by what you're looping. So far no pre-recorded loops have been triggered, so if you notice the global tempo has been miscalculated by a ÷2 or *2, surely it'd be easy to implement a [÷2 and *2] button that would re-calibrate the global tempo after live's guess before you drop the pre-made material? Maybe a hidden midi-assign button up near the global tempo readout.

- but then it wouldn't apply: Then you're starting a train wreck and THEN changing that - might be a good time to reconsider whether you need first-loop ability there!

FirstLoop, to me, is really a lot more useful is you "start from scratch" though - I hate hearing my 110bpm loops rolling at 90bpm.

illsub1 · Post by **illsub1** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 12:39 pm

Although the new transient detection and elastique algorithim will make that 20 bpm difference a lot more bearable!

Machinate · Post by **Machinate** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 1:30 pm

illsub1 wrote:Although the new transient detection and elastique algorithim will make that 20 bpm difference a lot more bearable!

oh definitely - esp the transient detection.

noisetonepause · Post by **noisetonepause** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 5:11 pm

The new warping is definitely my favourite new feature.

bland_handl · Post by **bland_handl** » Sun Jan 18, 2009 2:14 pm

Machinate wrote:
bland_handl wrote:
Angstrom wrote:...there's no foolproof way of determining what you are thinking of as you play one 4 second burst of notes. Was that 120 bpm , 60 bpm ? 240 bpm ?

It just makes a good guess at it. It's really intended to get you up and running in a freeform manner, I think it's not appropriate if you are just going to play 32 bars of improve and then segue into your languid pre-prepared breaks. Because, of course, if you were intending to bring in a pre-made bassline or some loop underneath then there could be problems if they leap in at 240 bpm under your mid-tempo loop.
In this example you're starting the performance with a live loop, and the global tempo is being set when by what you're looping. So far no pre-recorded loops have been triggered, so if you notice the global tempo has been miscalculated by a ÷2 or *2, surely it'd be easy to implement a [÷2 and *2] button that would re-calibrate the global tempo after live's guess before you drop the pre-made material? Maybe a hidden midi-assign button up near the global tempo readout.
- but then it wouldn't apply: Then you're starting a train wreck and THEN changing that - might be a good time to reconsider whether you need first-loop ability there!
FirstLoop, to me, is really a lot more useful is you "start from scratch" though - I hate hearing my 110bpm loops rolling at 90bpm.

I'm only going from what's written, so my apologies if I have misunderstood - but I think it's a practical question:

- I start with a free-form riff, catch it in looper and let the first loop determine global tempo...
- But let's say, as per Angstrom's suggestion, that the global tempo has been incorrectly guessed to be 240 bpm instead of 120.
- So what do I do next, with regards even to MIDI material I'd planned on triggering? Or sidechaining sources I was about to trigger to control gates/etc on my looper?

Is there any option to confirm the Global Tempo (ie, an option to half/double-time the value) before triggering these other clips?

To avoid the trainwreck this function would have to be only operating on the Global Tempo as a frame of reference, and so not alter the way the original looper material plays?

Geebag · Post by **Geebag** » Sun Jan 18, 2009 2:23 pm

What about an MPC and a pair of stilts?

Surreal · Post by **Surreal** » Sun Jan 18, 2009 2:54 pm

look at the picture guys.

2 things should give hope.

1: tempo control options. so, you should be able to link the tempo to the loop.

2: as per bland_handi's example--there ARE '*2' and '/2' buttons--i would think that, when tempo control is set to global or whatever the option is, halfing the tempo of the loop would halve the tempo of the song.

3dot... · Post by **3dot...** » Sun Jan 18, 2009 3:02 pm

bland_handl wrote:
Machinate wrote:
bland_handl wrote: In this example you're starting the performance with a live loop, and the global tempo is being set when by what you're looping. So far no pre-recorded loops have been triggered, so if you notice the global tempo has been miscalculated by a ÷2 or *2, surely it'd be easy to implement a [÷2 and *2] button that would re-calibrate the global tempo after live's guess before you drop the pre-made material? Maybe a hidden midi-assign button up near the global tempo readout.
- but then it wouldn't apply: Then you're starting a train wreck and THEN changing that - might be a good time to reconsider whether you need first-loop ability there!
FirstLoop, to me, is really a lot more useful is you "start from scratch" though - I hate hearing my 110bpm loops rolling at 90bpm.
I'm only going from what's written, so my apologies if I have misunderstood - but I think it's a practical question:

- I start with a free-form riff, catch it in looper and let the first loop determine global tempo...
- But let's say, as per Angstrom's suggestion, that the global tempo has been incorrectly guessed to be 240 bpm instead of 120.
- So what do I do next, with regards even to MIDI material I'd planned on triggering? Or sidechaining sources I was about to trigger to control gates/etc on my looper?

Is there any option to confirm the Global Tempo (ie, an option to half/double-time the value) before triggering these other clips?

To avoid the trainwreck this function would have to be only operating on the Global Tempo as a frame of reference, and so not alter the way the original looper material plays?

you could use 'tap tempo' before recording your loop I guess...

Machinate · Post by **Machinate** » Mon Jan 19, 2009 10:13 pm

bland_handl wrote: - I start with a free-form riff, catch it in looper and let the first loop determine global tempo...
- But let's say, as per Angstrom's suggestion, that the global tempo has been incorrectly guessed to be 240 bpm instead of 120.

that would probably require your "freeform loop" to be less than half a second long. Just... you know... FYI

bland_handl wrote:To avoid the trainwreck this function would have to be only operating on the Global Tempo as a frame of reference, and so not alter the way the original looper material plays?

yes, that would be "not using first-loop"