Ok, Live 9, what you like/dislike?

Discuss music production with Ableton Live.
H20nly
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Re: Ok, Live 9, what you like/dislike?

Post by H20nly » Sat Mar 09, 2013 6:30 am

[art] wrote:I think its great and worth the upgrade. when u break it down into a list of things, aside from the obvious, my favourite new features is Max for Live integration. Since i never had it before, its fresh for me. In fact it seems there's been a lot of focus on EQ8 and Glue, but the fact is M4L now adds to Live: Convolution Reverb and pro, LFO devices for midi and audio, Midi Echo, Buffer Shuffler, envelope grabber, the mono sequencer AND the Drum Synth - which is awesome IMO, and along with Convolution Reverb probably the two best new devices in Live 9. + there's loads more bundled. Not to mention Automation in Session, Convert Arrangement to session, Audio to Midi, and also something not many have discussed but the new ability to create default behaviours for new tracks is a really nice workflow enhancer. Live 9 is a change in the paradigm of Live, its a huge update! - a complete rewrite to achieve session automation so it's much more integrated with arrangement, the addition of Push and the inclusion of M4L is a real killer move - this is really where you'll see a lot of development from now on. Sure, there's a few kinks to work out given the changes, but they'll come. And yes of course, Push is the big one, but thats not really in many hands yet, so lets wait and see ;)
agreed.

and to add to that... i just installed an additional 16 GB of RAM in my iMac tonight, bringing me to a total of 20 GB... Live 9.0 is 64 bit.

Sean_Clarke
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Re: Ok, Live 9, what you like/dislike?

Post by Sean_Clarke » Sat Mar 09, 2013 8:30 am

The 64 bit upgrade of both live and M4L is worth the upgrade to me.

I am hoping that most people will go he suite route so that having M4L becomes 'the norm', the more M4L developers the better!

The content provided with Suite is now market leading for a DAW in my opinion, session drums multi mike & the orchestra packs are top notch.

Live 9 seems to be a good, sold 64 bit base to build from, I'm sure we will see lots of new stuff with free point updates as we go along....I hope this release and PUSH make Ableton a ton of money to secure future development and hiring talented coders.
DAWS: Live 11 Suite + PUSH2, Studio One, Bitwig and Reason all via an X32 desk: Instruments: modular and analogue stuff, guitars, basses and drums.

eddiex
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Re: Ok, Live 9, what you like/dislike?

Post by eddiex » Sat Mar 09, 2013 9:12 am

likes so far-
EQ8
THE GLUE
i like the different compressor views.
i don't feel strongly either way on the browser, except i really love the preview feature.
also, is it just me, or does 9 kind of sound better?
i feel comfortable putting on a couple more VSTs than usual.

dislikes so far-
i don't like that i am going to have to change all of my projects to live9 projects. i know it is just a simple process. but it means im going to have to go through and clean some house. not looking forward to it.


i haven't gotten into things seriously yet, im still just playing around. but over all, i feel i got my money's worth. there is nothing i hate about it.
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Vocane
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Re: Ok, Live 9, what you like/dislike?

Post by Vocane » Sat Mar 09, 2013 10:05 am

I very much dislike the fact that macro mapping parameters in an instrument or effect rack are still getting value zero in the macro knob section at the beginning of a rack instead of the original value of the parameter. Since I practically group everything and macro map the parameters that I want to use for automation - to keep things organised - this is a huge downer for me in terms of workflow and irritability.

I don't grasp why such a tiny thing couldn't have been fixed. Could somebody shed some light on this ??

Lephrenic
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Re: Ok, Live 9, what you like/dislike?

Post by Lephrenic » Sat Mar 09, 2013 10:11 am

Why was it necessary to move the Back To Arrangement button?
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madlab
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Re: Ok, Live 9, what you like/dislike?

Post by madlab » Sat Mar 09, 2013 10:22 am

ShelLuser wrote:Shameless self promotion in progress; I blogged about it (link).

Basically I think Live 9 (Suite) is a big improvement over Live 8 on several aspects. For example the new workflow where all your own setups won't find their way into the library but your user library instead, this is bound to make your whole setup more portable.

The inclusion of several new devices and instruments is IMO also quite good; things like the Glue compressor and the Orchestral Instrument Collection (I'm quite excited about those).

And then there's of course the set of new features. Like, for example, being able to extract harmony, melody or drums directly to MIDI.

But to be very honest the whole thing feels a bit unfinished to me. As if it was released before the intended date. For example; you pick up the included PDF manual, check the section about Max for Live only to see it filled with examples and scenario's which address the previous version.

And although all the sound presets are neatly sorted into categories (Bass, Brass, Pads, Strings..) the drums section is basically one big pile of presets, topped by the Drum rack.

That looks sloppy and feels unfinished to me. Especially when taken the clear separation of the sound presets into account, combined with the fact that this kind of separation was present in the Live 8 library. There I have a folder "Cymbal", "Hihat", "Snare" and even "Kit" which contains full drum kits.

Now I click "Drums" and end up with one big pile of percussion presets.

Sure; there is some separation when you collapse the "Drum hits" section. Just too bad that most of my presets seem to have ended up outside of that structure. It makes no sense; "Bongo A.adg" from Latin Percussion sits outside the structure, "Bongo A H Heel.adg" inside and under the "Bongo" section.

Same applies to Max for Live; that section has also become one big pile of devices. Which, IMO, makes it much harder to use. Especially since you can't easily start sorting it out yourself (you can't create new folders here).

So that is; not without copying stuff to your user library. But why would you want to copy files for the sole intention of sorting? As if keeping 2 (sample) libraries wasn't enough...

That's the other issue; the way they handled the Live 8 library. I know my way around all this, but I still say the lack of documentation on upgrading from 8 to 9 is boggling. I seriously wonder how many people basically (re-)install their livesets without realizing that they now actually keep the same samples in two locations at the same time (eating up precious diskspace). I'm of course referring to the Live 8 library in contrast to the new "Factory packs" folder.

Now, this may sound a little more negative than intended. In the overall I enjoy Live 9 and I think they made some serious progress on several fronts. Some of the new devices really add up to the workflow, the sound collection has been heavily enhanced, and in general the whole program seems to perform much better (start Live, turn APC40 on, continue working..).

Its really good. But, as mentioned, at some points it simply feels unfinished to me.
This browser system is what will keep me from upgrading for a while...
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madlab
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Re: Ok, Live 9, what you like/dislike?

Post by madlab » Sat Mar 09, 2013 10:24 am

Vocane wrote:I very much dislike the fact that macro mapping parameters in an instrument or effect rack are still getting value zero in the macro knob section at the beginning of a rack instead of the original value of the parameter. Since I practically group everything and macro map the parameters that I want to use for automation - to keep things organised - this is a huge downer for me in terms of workflow and irritability.

I don't grasp why such a tiny thing couldn't have been fixed. Could somebody shed some light on this ??
Shared feeling. This is the kind of stuff that makes live 9 look a bit unfinished.
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massenmedium
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Re: Ok, Live 9, what you like/dislike?

Post by massenmedium » Sat Mar 09, 2013 10:56 am

patrick.olson86 wrote:I still have issues warping non-EDM tracks, though (seriously, can warping be done easily without a four on the floor club beat?!?!).
Not always easily but usually if there aren't too many odd breaks or time changes it can be done. I've tackled some tricky ones.

With some things it's just self-defeating trying to warp the whole thing. With those you can try setting the right tempo and just have one marker at the first beat, or just a few at the start and end of the track.

[art]
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Re: Ok, Live 9, what you like/dislike?

Post by [art] » Sat Mar 09, 2013 12:34 pm

Lephrenic wrote:Why was it necessary to move the Back To Arrangement button?
Consistency. If you notice - each track now has its own 'back to arrangement button' - meaning you can add individual tracks back to arrangement, while playing clips in session view.

The main Back To Arrangement button now in this sense becomes a kind of 'All Back to Arrangement'.

This makes sense because Session and Arrangment automations are independent of each other, enabling you to flip between session and arrangement clips/automations independently and at will.

It's been moved because it's now in line with this new way of using BTA and is in line with the rest of the BTA buttons.

On the session page I'm not 100% sure why they moved it next to the Stop All button, again probably for consistency - but it is somewhat inconsistent. But given the arrangement button is within the track area it may have seemed weird to throw it back up where the transport is (for new users). At least its in the same vague area, and the same row as the loop indicators for each clip. In a way I guess its bunched in with the Scene buttons too.
Last edited by [art] on Sat Mar 09, 2013 12:44 pm, edited 3 times in total.

massenmedium
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Re: Ok, Live 9, what you like/dislike?

Post by massenmedium » Sat Mar 09, 2013 1:42 pm

Per track BTA? That sounds like an excellent change. Surprised they haven't made more noise about that.

cotdagoo
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Re: Ok, Live 9, what you like/dislike?

Post by cotdagoo » Sat Mar 09, 2013 1:53 pm

You know your software is ready for primetime when there's already betas out in less than 3 days of releasing it.

that's all I'm going to say on the subject.. really dislike beta software being sold as a finished product.

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Re: Ok, Live 9, what you like/dislike?

Post by v00d00ppl » Sat Mar 09, 2013 3:29 pm

Dislike that rewire still isn't working yet.
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nonnus
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Re: Ok, Live 9, what you like/dislike?

Post by nonnus » Sat Mar 09, 2013 4:13 pm

cotdagoo wrote:really dislike beta software being sold as a finished product.
ˆThis * 10000000000000

That is why i am not upgrading anytime soon, i know ableton could not care less but the only was i can make my point is with my wallet

deva
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Re: Ok, Live 9, what you like/dislike?

Post by deva » Sat Mar 09, 2013 4:47 pm

funken wrote:
madlab wrote:
Vocane wrote:I very much dislike the fact that macro mapping parameters in an instrument or effect rack are still getting value zero in the macro knob section at the beginning of a rack instead of the original value of the parameter. Since I practically group everything and macro map the parameters that I want to use for automation - to keep things organised - this is a huge downer for me in terms of workflow and irritability.

I don't grasp why such a tiny thing couldn't have been fixed. Could somebody shed some light on this ??
Shared feeling. This is the kind of stuff that makes live 9 look a bit unfinished.
Definitely one for the wishlist. There is one possible problem though, which is that you can map several parameters to one macro, and this might be a stumbling block.

I would rather the min/max default to a single value to keep the correct parameter state... I always adjust them anyway.

Parametex
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Re: Ok, Live 9, what you like/dislike?

Post by Parametex » Sat Mar 09, 2013 9:36 pm

Vocane wrote:I very much dislike the fact that macro mapping parameters in an instrument or effect rack are still getting value zero in the macro knob section at the beginning of a rack instead of the original value of the parameter. Since I practically group everything and macro map the parameters that I want to use for automation - to keep things organised - this is a huge downer for me in terms of workflow and irritability.

I don't grasp why such a tiny thing couldn't have been fixed. Could somebody shed some light on this ??
You just made a FUCKING GOOD point !!!!!!!

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