Where's the KEEP/REVERT OFFSET button gone?

dr.wackler · Post by **dr.wackler** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 12:24 am

Am I overlooking something or did they remove it in Live7 ???

I need this badly, was using it all the time!!

mike holiday · Post by **mike holiday** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 12:42 am

i hope this isn't a sacrifice for the edit button!

dr.wackler · Post by **dr.wackler** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 1:40 am

mike holiday wrote:i hope this isn't a sacrifice for the edit button!

At least, when the EDIT button was removed, it has been replaced by another method to achieve the same functionality.
But with KEEP/REVERT OFFSET it seems they removed the function completely. I can't find any hint in the manual, and can't find anything in any menu or context-menu.

Now I see: That is what Gerhard Behles meant in his famous "that's bullshit"-interview, when he was talking about "removing features" to be the way to go. I guess the final goal is to remove the Session View in Live 8 then. Let's remove all the features that make Live unique, top innovative!
Sorry for the cynical rant, but the KEEP/REVERT OFFSET function is very important for me - for several different tasks.

Please someone tell me I am just overlooking something and they've just hidden it somewhere else!

slicedbread · Post by **slicedbread** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 2:27 am

enlighten me. what was it and what would be a situation where you would use it? i don't remember this button.

dr.wackler · Post by **dr.wackler** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 3:12 am

slicedbread wrote:enlighten me. what was it and what would be a situation where you would use it? i don't remember this button.

Two buttons actually, one for "KEEP" and one for "REVERT". They used to be in Clip View, at the bottom left, below the two "Nudge" buttons (which are still there in Live 7), and could also be key-mapped or MIDI-mapped.

Situation1 (creative):
You have a Scene with several grooves running. Now you (re)trigger a single Clip of that Scene on a subposition, to shift the grooves against each other. In that case the beloved "orange dot" used to appear in the Clip's ruler to indicate the offset showing the virtually shiftet start position.
Hit the "KEEP" button, and the Start marker will be set to the shiftet position, so that the next time you launch the Scene, you'll hear exactly what you've just heard (the grooves shifted againt each other). Basically it's the same that happens when you capture a Scene: Start markers will be moved to the new positions - what you hear is what you get.

Situation2 (helpful):
You record a session into Arrange. While you are recording, you accidentaly launch a clip too early or too late. Normally you would have to stop the sequencer and start over again from where you made the mistake: Interrupts your musical flow, and you might loose your feeling for the intended song structure.
With the "REVERT" button mapped to a key or MIDI button you can quickly get that Clip into sync again and just go on recording your session without interrupting your musical flow. Later on it's easy to correct the mistake in the Arrange view by dragging the left border of the correct Clip (the one that got recorded after you hit the "REVERT" button).

Gaubie · Post by **Gaubie** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 3:38 am

That Keep/Revert/<</>> is a nice feature. It's at the bottom of the clip box.

When i DJ i use it sometimes when I'm cuing another track. For me it's a quick way to switch the down beat with the up beat of the track I am 'bout to mix in, cause sometimes the result it cool. If I don't like the result, REVERT! Or just tapping a couple more times depending on the global quantize.

Also, it's great for improvised half or one bar looping when you assign << button to a MIDI button or key. Then you set the global quantize accordingly. Then to the beat, or click track to the cans, << to the beat.

AND it's great for sound designing purposes too. Set the global quantize to none, drag the mouse on different places of the audio file, and resample the result!
Or use it as a scrubbing ore stuttering effect.

I know there other ways to achieve these same results in Live more accuretly, but they aren't as "on the fly" as this Keep/Revert/<</>> button!

I hope it's not lost forever

mike holiday · Post by **mike holiday** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 1:48 pm

keep/revert kinda go along with the FOD, but not in function..

when you change the start offset of a playing loop you get neat effects.

revert snaps back to the original offset, keep keeps the new offset

slicedbread · Post by **slicedbread** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 2:06 pm

i do seem to remember something like that but i never used it live. i guess i've just been making do with the sample offset arrow beneath the loop start arrow. maybe the functionality still exists as a hot key somewhere.

dr.wackler · Post by **dr.wackler** » Sat Jan 12, 2008 3:33 pm

http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic. ... highlight=

mike holiday · Post by **mike holiday** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 5:18 pm

i have just found something very interesting.

I was editing my template set, opened up the midi mapping browser to delete unwanted midi mappings, and low and behold the mapings for keep/revert offset still appeared in the browser. So i did a little testing and they still work

dr.wackler · Post by **dr.wackler** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 6:57 pm

mike holiday wrote:i have just found something very interesting.

I was editing my template set, opened up the midi mapping browser to delete unwanted midi mappings, and low and behold the mapings for keep/revert offset still appeared in the browser. So i did a little testing and they still work

Replied to in the other thread:
http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic. ... 457#616457